Desert storm Iraqi AF Losses ( claimed vs actual )

Cold war, Korea, Vietnam, and Desert Storm - up to and including for example the A-10, F-15, Mirage 200, MiG-29, and F-18.
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old.iraqi.air.force

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Unread post10 Aug 2015, 22:09

Yes i will add that.
oldiaf wrote:Any activities on the fourth day Jan 20 ? Or the fellowing days before the attempted raid on Saudi territory Jan 24 ?

Yes i will add that.
oldiaf wrote:Also Saad airbase same H2 ?? And Tamuz airbase same as Habaniya ??

Yes that's right (in some case we call Plateau in Arabic Al-Hadaba referring to British part at Habaniya AB.
oldiaf wrote:I read before that he was No.2 but the formation leader had a problem with the aircraft that prevent it from taking off but Lt. Nafie Najim asked the formation leader to proceed with his No.2 aircraft

Yes correct, but how did you even knew this one?!!
oldiaf wrote:I have counted so far 22 sorties plus 2 aborted . The US claimed the IrAF flown 24 sorties on the first 24 hours
I have noted: There are missing events belong to January 17-1991 regarding to southern air bases such Shuaiba and Nasiriyah AB due to absence involved people and loss of many documents
oldiaf wrote:Jalibah Airfield was it in southern Iraq ?!!

Yes south Ali/Tallil Air Base 30.547272, 46.604498
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Unread post11 Aug 2015, 00:11

I also understood he was Diabetic and he had a broken arm before and I learned that Aircraft SN he used in 1991 was 4021 and the one he used in his last mission was 4571 !
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Unread post11 Aug 2015, 21:48

On Jan 24 1991 , 2 Mirages piloted by Ali Alobaidi and Mohammed Salim tried to attack an oil port in KSA - this is the third attempt as the day before and the day before that, they tried to mount the raid but prevented from taking off because of the risk of being shut down by circling F-15s, this time they made it and to the suprise of Iraqis themselves !! Later it is cleared that the US aircrafts didn't challenge them because the CAP on their location was the duty f Navy F-14s and these Pacific fleet F-14 Radios was not operated on the same frequency of the E-3 AWACS of the USAF but on that of the E-2C of the Navy ( the Iraqis claimed they heard the screaming of the AWACS operator to the F-14s to intercept the Mirages but to no avail !! ) . after refuelling in the air by another two Mirages they proceeded to the Target ... It is not known exactly who downed them - The Saudis and Coalition claimed that a Saudi F15 operated by Alshamrani usedtwo AIM-9 sidewinder to shoot them he even claimed on TV interview that he was so close to them that he saw the second pilot looking to the formation leader in horror - The Iraqis claimed that the most reasonable cause for their downing was US Navy ships .
Pilot Mohammed Salim body was never recovered in the sea while Ali Alobaidi ejected but was injured and captured by the Saudis and he they had to amputate his legs but he died later and his body and death certificate was issued to the Iraqis by the Saudis .
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old.iraqi.air.force

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Unread post12 Aug 2015, 01:59

On Jan 24-1991 we lost the two Mirage F1EQ4s flown by Major. Ali Hussein Fadel and Capt. Mohammed Saleem from 89Sq of Abu Ubaidah AB in mission to attack Saudi refinery “Ras Tanura” the two Iraq Mirage was loaded by (x2 400Kg SAMP parachute bombs + x1 2200 drop tank + x1 sicomor + x1 Remora ECM pod + x2 R.550 Magic + 30mm DEFA cannon with 250 rounds) they did took off at 11:49:30 from Abu Ubaidah air base (TOT 1245) and fly south along the Iranian border at extremely low altitude 30 to 50m, with very high speed 940kph to minimize the chances of any detection. After successfully complete their air refueling couple time the formation continued to fly less than 50 meters with 960Kph heading towards to Ras Tanura, whith skillful pilots and good planning Major Ali and No2 Mohammad Saleem successfully rip off coalition naval units and cross Saudi territorial waters, the two Iraqi Mirages flew along a control boundary between the U.S. Air Force and Navy as well. The Iraqi Mirages made it to a point approximately 70km south of the Kuwaiti border just off the Saudi coast without being challenged. the coalition had constant patrol of F-14 and F-18 to the south west of Kuwait some of these patrols aircraft had intercepted them but did not succeed, Major Ali “the formation leader” being shot down by coalition navy, but he managed to eject and lost one of his foot during ejaculation process and he was survived 84 days in a Saudi hospital “but he died for unknown reasons the death certificate did not mention the reason!”, Capt. Mohammad Saleem “we don’t know for sure he is being shot down by coalition navy and wasn’t able to eject or flown into the water ” regrettably his body did not recovered. There is no Saudi F-15s involved in the incident.
The air base was under attack repeatedly that's why prevented them from taking off.
There was no surprise, It was a military order and must be implemented.
No one heard the AWACS screaming at all, this is inaccurate..
Saudi F15 Pilot Ayedh Alshamrani claimed two different story on TV interview and to the press and each one do not match with the other and this in itself denies his involvement.
-Once he claimed that he came close to them less than 20 meter and he saw the the formation leader in horror and turn back and fired his missiles to shot them down (I think if there is some one was in real horror it must be the claimer no one else) for some unique reasons 1.These two Iraqi pilots flown in tough exceptional circumstances with the feeling of the brunt of the war and certain death in battle they successfully completed their air refueling on low altitude for twice with bad weather condition this reflects their insistence to face the battle and do their duty and their high skills fighting.
On other interview Saudi F15 Pilot Ayedh Alshamrani claimed: "I am positive they knew I was there, some plane had intercepted them," Ayedh said. "They just started breaking in front of me, but it was too late."
Ayedh said he fired two Sidewinder missiles, first at one Mirage and then at the other, within about five seconds.
Now as you can see two claims to one story..
Photo to Major. Ali Hussein Fadel
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Photo to Capt. Mohammed Saleem
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Rest in peace good friends and your place in depths of our heart

A copy of the death certificate Major. Ali Hussein Fadel which did not mention any reason
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Saudi F15 Pilot Ayedh Alshamrani claim:
http://articles.latimes.com/1991-01-25/news/mn-767_1_saudi-arabia
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Unread post13 Aug 2015, 10:22

On the 9th day Jan 25 1991 F-117a used GBU-27 bunker buster bombs to penetrate the hardened aircraft shelters. Was the effect of this impacted the Iraqi government to send its aircrafts to Iran ? Probably and probably not , such a move most be planned before but was the destruction of hardened shelters ultimately set the date for such a move ?!
The exodus started on Jan 26 among those flown away 7 Su-25s - these 7 returned from Iran in 2014 / the only Iraqi planes returned by Iran adding to 5 Su-25 second hand from Russia.
Last edited by oldiaf on 13 Aug 2015, 14:09, edited 1 time in total.
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Unread post13 Aug 2015, 14:08

Jan 26
3 MiG-23s claimed by USAF F-15s, 4 MiG-23s took off from a base in western Iraq, 1 returned to base because of malfunction and 3 proceeded , the F-15s picked them up in classical BVR engagement using AIM-7s
All form Squadron/wing 58/33 :
Draeger - Schiavi - Rodriguez
The next day Jan 27 another 3 MiG-23s were downed by F-15s this time by 2 pilots from squadron/wing 53/36 Denney and Powell, Denney used a sidewinder AIM-9 while Powell used Sparrow AIM-7 , also Powell claimed a Mirage F.1 the same day using AIM-7.
The Iraqis on the other hands claimed that a formation of 3 MiG-23s from squadron 73 took off from H2 Saad Airbase to be repositioned at Balad Bakr Air Base , these 3 planes piloted by Shakir Raihan - Kareem - Amir Hasan . The first 2 get hit by US F-15s and pilots KIA while the third one managed to return to its base .
It is unknown which engagement this one is : the one of 26 or 27 of Jan 1991
What was the purpose of these flights and repositionings ? A better shelters ? A closer base for future AA combat ? A closer base to flow them to Iran later ? Providing escort to escaping bombers to Iran ?
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Unread post13 Aug 2015, 15:51

I also understood that during the attempted raid of 24 Jan that was carried by 2 Mirages witnessed the destruction of another 2 Mirages on the ground 2 days earlier that were being prepared for the mission and another one the day before the operation.
Also I am confused about the refuelling two aircrafts wether they were another 2 Mirages or MiG-23s as witnessed by the Americans.
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Unread post13 Aug 2015, 16:29

I'm curious if you know this..

There's a story about some Iraqi aircraft (Mig's?) that go sandwiched between a flight of F-14's and F-15's. The story goes that when they got lit up by the F-14's radar, they turned around and elected to fight the F-15's!

True?

And if so, why type of Iraqi aircraft were they?
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Unread post13 Aug 2015, 16:58

mixelflick wrote:I'm curious if you know this..

There's a story about some Iraqi aircraft (Mig's?) that go sandwiched between a flight of F-14's and F-15's. The story goes that when they got lit up by the F-14's radar, they turned around and elected to fight the F-15's!

True?

And if so, why type of Iraqi aircraft were they?

Never heard about this in DS 1991 but there ia a similar incident in 1999 involved MiG-25s against F-14s and F-15s
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Unread post14 Aug 2015, 02:11

Never heard about this in DS 1991 but there ia a similar incident in 1999 involved MiG-25s against F-14s and F-15s[/quote]

Really?

Can you tell me more about it?
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Unread post14 Aug 2015, 06:01

mixelflick wrote:Never heard about this in DS 1991 but there ia a similar incident in 1999 involved MiG-25s against F-14s and F-15s


Really?

Can you tell me more about it?[/quote]
3 or 4 MiG-25 violated the southern No fly zone and engaged a formation of 2 USAF F-15 and 2 USN F-14 , the American planes fired 6 missiles between AMRAAM from the F-15s and Phoenix from the F-14s but the MiG-25s out run them using their high speed.
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Unread post14 Aug 2015, 14:36

oldiaf wrote:3 or 4 MiG-25 violated the southern No fly zone and engaged a formation of 2 USAF F-15 and 2 USN F-14 , the American planes fired 6 missiles between AMRAAM from the F-15s and Phoenix from the F-14s but the MiG-25s out run them using their high speed.

Was four MIG-25s and coalition aircraft fired Sparrow and Phoenix missiles.
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Unread post14 Aug 2015, 14:41

oldiaf wrote:On the 9th day Jan 25 1991 F-117a used GBU-27 bunker buster bombs to penetrate the hardened aircraft shelters. Was the effect of this impacted the Iraqi government to send its aircrafts to Iran ? Probably and probably not , such a move most be planned before but was the destruction of hardened shelters ultimately set the date for such a move ?!
The exodus started on Jan 26 among those flown away 7 Su-25s - these 7 returned from Iran in 2014 / the only Iraqi planes returned by Iran adding to 5 Su-25 second hand from Russia.


It was a political decision of Iraqi government to send its aircrafts to Iran has other political dimensions..
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Unread post14 Aug 2015, 14:54

oldiaf wrote:Jan 26
3 MiG-23s claimed by USAF F-15s, 4 MiG-23s took off from a base in western Iraq, 1 returned to base because of malfunction and 3 proceeded , the F-15s picked them up in classical BVR engagement using AIM-7s
All form Squadron/wing 58/33 :
Draeger - Schiavi - Rodriguez
The next day Jan 27 another 3 MiG-23s were downed by F-15s this time by 2 pilots from squadron/wing 53/36 Denney and Powell, Denney used a sidewinder AIM-9 while Powell used Sparrow AIM-7 , also Powell claimed a Mirage F.1 the same day using AIM-7.
The Iraqis on the other hands claimed that a formation of 3 MiG-23s from squadron 73 took off from H2 Saad Airbase to be repositioned at Balad Bakr Air Base , these 3 planes piloted by Shakir Raihan - Kareem - Amir Hasan . The first 2 get hit by US F-15s and pilots KIA while the third one managed to return to its base .
It is unknown which engagement this one is : the one of 26 or 27 of Jan 1991
What was the purpose of these flights and repositionings ? A better shelters ? A closer base for future AA combat ? A closer base to flow them to Iran later ? Providing escort to escaping bombers to Iran ?


On Jan 26-1991 we lost two MIG-23MLs, the formation was consists by Major Shaker Rehan Hammoud and Capt.Kareem Hassan and Capt.Faisal all the three pilots from 73Sq, took off from Saad AB to evacuate the aircraft to al-Bakr AB, first Major Shaker Rehan the formation leader was shot down and KIA, then in visual contact Capt.Kareem clashed with a group of F-15s but later shot down and KIA, Capt.Faisal managed of disengage and back to land safely.
One Jan 27-1991 Iraqi Mirage flown by Capt.Thaer al Sieed 79Sq hit a hills formation due to the low altitude and air robe “there was no threat at all”.
This all Iraqi AF losses between 26 and 27 January 1991
Major Shaker Rehan photo
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Unread post14 Aug 2015, 15:17

oldiaf wrote:I also understood that during the attempted raid of 24 Jan that was carried by 2 Mirages witnessed the destruction of another 2 Mirages on the ground 2 days earlier that were being prepared for the mission and another one the day before the operation.
Also I am confused about the refuelling two aircrafts wether they were another 2 Mirages or MiG-23s as witnessed by the Americans.

Yes two Mirages destroyed on the ground before, on January 24 the airbase was under attack between 0900 and 0930. No MiG-23s involved in this mission, first they did took off at 0945 but one of the tanker aircraft (Mirage) got a malfunction and force them to turn back to airbase, after switch it with another Mirage they flew again at 1149.

Copy of the warrant commissioning
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