America does not need the Air Force

Discuss air warfare, doctrine, air forces, historic campaigns, etc.
  • Author
  • Message
Offline

newmanfrigan

Active Member

Active Member

  • Posts: 143
  • Joined: 19 Jun 2013, 05:14
  • Location: Kansas City, MO

Unread post23 Dec 2013, 21:31

lookieloo wrote:
mk82 wrote:David Axe = epic fail! Why don't we just ignore his garbage? He has nothing useful to contribute FULL STOP.
@everyone here

First off, I think it's important to understand that Axe is a follower, not a leader, who repackages the ideas of a narrow cadre of semi-informed dilettantes and contrarians, most of whom share a similar political/philosophical bent. As for why I posted said drivel here, I think it's important to keep tabs on what people like Axe and others of his kind are saying because, like it or not, they have better access to a general audience than any of us. I don't know if anyone else noticed before they became a member, but f-16.net frequently pops up as a link during searches related to military aviation, making this site an optimum place for rebuttal and a frequent thorn-in-the-side for the likes of Bill Sweetman and his ilk (he complains about us all the time elsewhere).


Sweetman is my personal favorite airplane enthusiast. He gives me laughter and grist for the thought mill. He has referred to F16.net posters as "fankiddies" over on......wait for it........keypubs. That kind of statement tells you all you need to know, but he's also had his hindquarters handed to him on a regular basis on Secret Projects forum (which is quite good, despite a recent influx of Keypublicans)....he decided he would take his toys and go home, never again to comment on their F-35 thread, because, as he stated, "there are still other places on the internet where respectful and rational debate still take place". Those would apparently be the same forums where Russia is still a military superpower, Slowman is an oracle, Lockmart is corrupt and powerful enough to convince the leading airforces of the World to mortgage their very existence and national security just to buy an inferior plane, Sukhoi/EADS/Boeing are honorable but feisty underdogs, and where turning gunfights mano a mano are the order of the day, completely divorced from network/supporting assets. At least Sweetman has some command of the English language and has a deep basket of aerospace trivia information to draw on....

Which brings us to Axe. The thing about Axe that I wonder is why, why in the world has he chosen the subject of military technology to appoint himself an expert of? He seems not only highly uncredentialed and uninformed, but also incurious and lazy. Most of what he gets wrong could have been remedied by even basic googling, or a decent editor. His writing style and analyses are really more worthy of a celebrity gossip columnist analysing baby bumps, with the sneering tone and the constant insinuations of personal corruption he employs.

To me, Sweetman, Axe, Sprey....a lot of these guys are actually pretty fascinating cases of abnormal psychology. Sweetman has made many statements that indicate he thinks of himself as leading or participating in a campaign against the mainstream reporting (what he implies is that Lockmart spin dominates the news cycle), when it's really quite the opposite; he's one of the leading voices of the actual, sorry-assed mainstream narrative. The mainstream pt of view is that the F-35 is piece of garbage. Of course this point of view is itself garbage, but the psychology involved is interesting. Sweetman as David vs. Lockmarts goliath. David Axe is seemingly just another boring hipster, but again, why appoint yourself Mr. Military if you have no real passion, experience, education, understanding or even motivation to master the topic? I would love to here some of my fellow members theories about how a guy like that ends up talking Nuke Subs and not I-Pads. Sprey we've done to death already...I'm afraid he's simply an egomaniac. I'd also be interested in hearing any of your opinions about the psychology of the APA guys, Goon and what's-his-face, as I don't know a lot about them personally other than they are/were at least nominally professionally involved in military aerospace.

Merry Christmas folks.
Offline
User avatar

XanderCrews

Elite 5K

Elite 5K

  • Posts: 6368
  • Joined: 16 Oct 2012, 19:42

Unread post17 Feb 2014, 05:57

newmanfrigan wrote:. David Axe is seemingly just another boring hipster, but again, why appoint yourself Mr. Military if you have no real passion, experience, education, understanding or even motivation to master the topic? I would love to here some of my fellow members theories about how a guy like that ends up talking Nuke Subs and not I-Pads.


don't be daft, its far easier and safer to take the route that Axe did... I mean how else does a young military age male learn about the military? by reading internet articles and blowing them up to get web traffic, silly. Not by actually serving and learning a job with things like standards and expectations, along with real mortal danger. It's not like we have had a need for young men in the military the last 13 years or anything.

As a 19 year old I enlisted in 2002. So at a younger age I knew more, first hand, and 3 years before Axe started "reporting" on the military.

https://d262ilb51hltx0.cloudfront.net/m ... mDe0o.jpeg

^ A picture of david taken by his best friend in the world. ^

I have zero respect for that petulant child, and its probably best I don't think about it or I will become angry... you wouldn't like me when I'm angry.


Sprey we've done to death already...I'm afraid he's simply an egomaniac. I'd also be interested in hearing any of your opinions about the psychology of the APA guys, Goon and what's-his-face, as I don't know a lot about them personally other than they are/were at least nominally professionally involved in military aerospace.
.


Those guys are seriously "off" mentally. Thats not even me trying to be mean. I have had run ins with them. I know others that have had run ins with them, and they are not all there. No kidding. they run an awesome fictional/alternate history website that is light on facts or reality, but makes up for it with pretty pictures and graphics. shiny things that really appeal to that kind of audience.
Choose Crews
Offline

lookieloo

Elite 1K

Elite 1K

  • Posts: 1244
  • Joined: 16 Feb 2013, 08:04

Unread post18 Feb 2014, 05:16

The fun continues, with Axe (the Perez Hilton of defense-industry journalism) allowing yet another crackpot onto his blog....
https://medium.com/war-is-boring/7bacfd30ffa9
...yet the guy does pose an interesting dilemma at the end: How does one maintain a competent, motivated air force when it involves nothing more than polishing the a$$-end of a drone operated from some cubical?
Offline
User avatar

KamenRiderBlade

Elite 2K

Elite 2K

  • Posts: 2640
  • Joined: 24 Nov 2012, 02:20
  • Location: USA

Unread post19 Feb 2014, 03:30

newmanfrigan wrote:
lookieloo wrote:
mk82 wrote:David Axe = epic fail! Why don't we just ignore his garbage? He has nothing useful to contribute FULL STOP.
@everyone here

First off, I think it's important to understand that Axe is a follower, not a leader, who repackages the ideas of a narrow cadre of semi-informed dilettantes and contrarians, most of whom share a similar political/philosophical bent. As for why I posted said drivel here, I think it's important to keep tabs on what people like Axe and others of his kind are saying because, like it or not, they have better access to a general audience than any of us. I don't know if anyone else noticed before they became a member, but f-16.net frequently pops up as a link during searches related to military aviation, making this site an optimum place for rebuttal and a frequent thorn-in-the-side for the likes of Bill Sweetman and his ilk (he complains about us all the time elsewhere).


Sweetman is my personal favorite airplane enthusiast. He gives me laughter and grist for the thought mill. He has referred to F16.net posters as "fankiddies" over on......wait for it........keypubs. That kind of statement tells you all you need to know, but he's also had his hindquarters handed to him on a regular basis on Secret Projects forum (which is quite good, despite a recent influx of Keypublicans)....he decided he would take his toys and go home, never again to comment on their F-35 thread, because, as he stated, "there are still other places on the internet where respectful and rational debate still take place". Those would apparently be the same forums where Russia is still a military superpower, Slowman is an oracle, Lockmart is corrupt and powerful enough to convince the leading airforces of the World to mortgage their very existence and national security just to buy an inferior plane, Sukhoi/EADS/Boeing are honorable but feisty underdogs, and where turning gunfights mano a mano are the order of the day, completely divorced from network/supporting assets. At least Sweetman has some command of the English language and has a deep basket of aerospace trivia information to draw on....

Which brings us to Axe. The thing about Axe that I wonder is why, why in the world has he chosen the subject of military technology to appoint himself an expert of? He seems not only highly uncredentialed and uninformed, but also incurious and lazy. Most of what he gets wrong could have been remedied by even basic googling, or a decent editor. His writing style and analyses are really more worthy of a celebrity gossip columnist analysing baby bumps, with the sneering tone and the constant insinuations of personal corruption he employs.

To me, Sweetman, Axe, Sprey....a lot of these guys are actually pretty fascinating cases of abnormal psychology. Sweetman has made many statements that indicate he thinks of himself as leading or participating in a campaign against the mainstream reporting (what he implies is that Lockmart spin dominates the news cycle), when it's really quite the opposite; he's one of the leading voices of the actual, sorry-assed mainstream narrative. The mainstream pt of view is that the F-35 is piece of garbage. Of course this point of view is itself garbage, but the psychology involved is interesting. Sweetman as David vs. Lockmarts goliath. David Axe is seemingly just another boring hipster, but again, why appoint yourself Mr. Military if you have no real passion, experience, education, understanding or even motivation to master the topic? I would love to here some of my fellow members theories about how a guy like that ends up talking Nuke Subs and not I-Pads. Sprey we've done to death already...I'm afraid he's simply an egomaniac. I'd also be interested in hearing any of your opinions about the psychology of the APA guys, Goon and what's-his-face, as I don't know a lot about them personally other than they are/were at least nominally professionally involved in military aerospace.

Merry Christmas folks.


Some of the crap these guys spew makes Alex Jones look sane (sometimes) which is a real credit or discredit to either side.
Offline
User avatar

smsgtmac

Forum Veteran

Forum Veteran

  • Posts: 866
  • Joined: 02 Mar 2013, 04:22
  • Location: Texas

Unread post19 Feb 2014, 06:14

lookieloo wrote:The fun continues, with Axe (the Perez Hilton of defense-industry journalism) allowing yet another crackpot onto his blog....
https://medium.com/war-is-boring/7bacfd30ffa9
...yet the guy does pose an interesting dilemma at the end: How does one maintain a competent, motivated air force when it involves nothing more than polishing the a$$-end of a drone operated from some cubical?


Axe practices Punk Journalism. He's just one of the errand boys (As Glenn H. Reynolds 'Instapundit' likes to say: "sent by grocery clerks"). I wouldn't have even bothered to burn him down on the DOT&E report except I had a nice invite. http://op-for.com/2014/02/punk-journalism-and-the-f-35.html.
Farley's a different 'act'. A 'Reformer Wannabe' possibly. Certainly a Wannabe Something. He's got a typical Post-Modern 'International Relations' read-wide-not-deep-view of war and the military, and specifically the AF. He's clueless as to the military mind or motivation, and trades in Strawmen, Non Sequiturs, Hasty Generalizations, Red Herrings as well as Misleading Vividness (and that was just in the Axe 'piece'). He's full of inconsequential knowledge and unfortunately is not afraid to fling it at people. I'm pretty sure I've got a bead on the 'major' and 'minor' premises he's working from already worked out. The only thing I don't know yet is which is which. All depends on cause and effect in that tenure-track chasing noggin of his.
--The ultimate weapon is the mind of man.
Offline
User avatar

KamenRiderBlade

Elite 2K

Elite 2K

  • Posts: 2640
  • Joined: 24 Nov 2012, 02:20
  • Location: USA

Unread post19 Feb 2014, 06:27

smsgtmac wrote:
lookieloo wrote:The fun continues, with Axe (the Perez Hilton of defense-industry journalism) allowing yet another crackpot onto his blog....
https://medium.com/war-is-boring/7bacfd30ffa9
...yet the guy does pose an interesting dilemma at the end: How does one maintain a competent, motivated air force when it involves nothing more than polishing the a$$-end of a drone operated from some cubical?


Axe practices Punk Journalism. He's just one of the errand boys (As Glenn H. Reynolds 'Instapundit' likes to say: "sent by grocery clerks"). I wouldn't have even bothered to burn him down on the DOT&E report except I had a nice invite. http://op-for.com/2014/02/punk-journalism-and-the-f-35.html.
Farley's a different 'act'. A 'Reformer Wannabe' possibly. Certainly a Wannabe Something. He's got a typical Post-Modern 'International Relations' read-wide-not-deep-view of war and the military, and specifically the AF. He's clueless as to the military mind or motivation, and trades in Strawmen, Non Sequiturs, Hasty Generalizations, Red Herrings as well as Misleading Vividness (and that was just in the Axe 'piece'). He's full of inconsequential knowledge and unfortunately is not afraid to fling it at people. I'm pretty sure I've got a bead on the 'major' and 'minor' premises he's working from already worked out. The only thing I don't know yet is which is which. All depends on cause and effect in that tenure-track chasing noggin of his.



I wish there was a way to expose people like Axe, Sprey, Sweetman for the hacks they are to the entire world and have them black listed from the world of journalism, they give real journalists a bad name and make bad journalists like Alex Jones look half decent. That's saying something if you can make the nut job that is Alex Jones look half decent.
Offline

newmanfrigan

Active Member

Active Member

  • Posts: 143
  • Joined: 19 Jun 2013, 05:14
  • Location: Kansas City, MO

Unread post19 Feb 2014, 21:27

smsgtmac wrote:
lookieloo wrote:The fun continues, with Axe (the Perez Hilton of defense-industry journalism) allowing yet another crackpot onto his blog....
https://medium.com/war-is-boring/7bacfd30ffa9
...yet the guy does pose an interesting dilemma at the end: How does one maintain a competent, motivated air force when it involves nothing more than polishing the a$$-end of a drone operated from some cubical?


Axe practices Punk Journalism. He's just one of the errand boys (As Glenn H. Reynolds 'Instapundit' likes to say: "sent by grocery clerks"). I wouldn't have even bothered to burn him down on the DOT&E report except I had a nice invite. http://op-for.com/2014/02/punk-journalism-and-the-f-35.html.
Farley's a different 'act'. A 'Reformer Wannabe' possibly. Certainly a Wannabe Something. He's got a typical Post-Modern 'International Relations' read-wide-not-deep-view of war and the military, and specifically the AF. He's clueless as to the military mind or motivation, and trades in Strawmen, Non Sequiturs, Hasty Generalizations, Red Herrings as well as Misleading Vividness (and that was just in the Axe 'piece'). He's full of inconsequential knowledge and unfortunately is not afraid to fling it at people. I'm pretty sure I've got a bead on the 'major' and 'minor' premises he's working from already worked out. The only thing I don't know yet is which is which. All depends on cause and effect in that tenure-track chasing noggin of his.


An absolutely devastating and perfect takedown of this clown. Now, if only we could get more people to read it. I'll be sharing your piece anyway...
Offline

strykerxo

Senior member

Senior member

  • Posts: 436
  • Joined: 21 Mar 2008, 04:40

Unread post20 Feb 2014, 00:10

I would like to second Ol'Axe and do one better.

We don't need an air arm of the Navy. With hyper-velocity missiles, rail guns and lasers why do we need carriers and all its support ships, protection, manpower and trillion price tag. :doh:
You can't shot what you can't see - Unknown
Offline
User avatar

smsgtmac

Forum Veteran

Forum Veteran

  • Posts: 866
  • Joined: 02 Mar 2013, 04:22
  • Location: Texas

Unread post20 Feb 2014, 03:18

KamenRiderBlade wrote:I wish there was a way to expose people like Axe, Sprey, Sweetman for the hacks they are to the entire world and have them black listed from the world of journalism, they give real journalists a bad name and make bad journalists like Alex Jones look half decent. That's saying something if you can make the nut job that is Alex Jones look half decent.


Just keep pointing at the stupidity and laughing at it. This is a generational thing. Arguments made by Sprey, Wheeler, etc were cowed in the general public forum for about a decade in the wake of Desert Storm, after all those terribly complex systems cut through Saddam and Co like butter. Even then, the 'reform crowd' never really recanted or retracted, they merely explained away the successes and kept on fundraising among the faithful while the rest of the world's arms builders reeled in the aftershocks from the war. Now there's a whole new generation of people who have no memory of the real successes of the 'American Way' of technology development, but they are bombarded by the memes proffered by POGO et al. throughout the echo chambers on the web run by the Punk Journalists and aging hipsters. You will notice these types will never engage in an open exchange, but post where comments no agreeing with the approved POV are either not permitted, moderated, or ignored.

Speaking of stupidity and laughing...One of Axe's stablemates has a 'piece' where in so many words he laments the CBS 60 minutes article for not having any views from people who have no idea what is going on in the program or an understanding of the technology. https://medium.com/war-is-boring/3914aaf3ce5d I'd love to know who's hand is on the spoon that's feeding him.
--The ultimate weapon is the mind of man.
Offline
User avatar

smsgtmac

Forum Veteran

Forum Veteran

  • Posts: 866
  • Joined: 02 Mar 2013, 04:22
  • Location: Texas

Unread post20 Feb 2014, 03:28

newmanfrigan wrote:
smsgtmac wrote:
lookieloo wrote:The fun continues, with Axe (the Perez Hilton of defense-industry journalism) allowing yet another crackpot onto his blog....
https://medium.com/war-is-boring/7bacfd30ffa9
...yet the guy does pose an interesting dilemma at the end: How does one maintain a competent, motivated air force when it involves nothing more than polishing the a$$-end of a drone operated from some cubical?


Axe practices Punk Journalism. He's just one of the errand boys (As Glenn H. Reynolds 'Instapundit' likes to say: "sent by grocery clerks"). I wouldn't have even bothered to burn him down on the DOT&E report except I had a nice invite. http://op-for.com/2014/02/punk-journalism-and-the-f-35.html.
Farley's a different 'act'. A 'Reformer Wannabe' possibly. Certainly a Wannabe Something. He's got a typical Post-Modern 'International Relations' read-wide-not-deep-view of war and the military, and specifically the AF. He's clueless as to the military mind or motivation, and trades in Strawmen, Non Sequiturs, Hasty Generalizations, Red Herrings as well as Misleading Vividness (and that was just in the Axe 'piece'). He's full of inconsequential knowledge and unfortunately is not afraid to fling it at people. I'm pretty sure I've got a bead on the 'major' and 'minor' premises he's working from already worked out. The only thing I don't know yet is which is which. All depends on cause and effect in that tenure-track chasing noggin of his.


An absolutely devastating and perfect takedown of this clown. Now, if only we could get more people to read it. I'll be sharing your piece anyway...


Thanks, I appreciate it! It was too easy. While experience helped spotting the BS, I just had to take time to look up the publically available data.

The Harkonnens (Punk Journalists) are our enemies, yes. But behind them, I suspect, is the Emperor (POGO etal)
--The ultimate weapon is the mind of man.
Previous

Return to Air Power

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests