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Re: Indian Mirage 2000 hits targets in Pakistan

Unread postPosted: 27 Feb 2019, 22:10
by hythelday
armedupdate wrote:F-16 should be able to take on SU-30 in BVR. Unlike the F-15 which can Mach 2.5, the SU-30 goes the speed speed as the F-16.


Except that F-15 never even came close to Mach 2 in combat operations, but OK.

Re: Indian Mirage 2000 hits targets in Pakistan

Unread postPosted: 27 Feb 2019, 23:07
by basher54321
This video is released by a #Pakistan Air Force personnel shows 14sq Leader, Hasan Siddiqui upon his return to #Minhas AB after shooting down CU2328, a MiG-21 Bison of #India Air Force's 51sq today. His airplane is 15-201, a JF-17 Block-II of 16th Multi Role Squadron.

https://twitter.com/i/status/1100751163287322624

Re: Indian Mirage 2000 hits targets in Pakistan

Unread postPosted: 27 Feb 2019, 23:23
by weasel1962
USAF would be interested observers, if anything just to see if Chinese missiles work.

Re: Indian Mirage 2000 hits targets in Pakistan

Unread postPosted: 27 Feb 2019, 23:53
by basher54321
Patriot wrote:They have a few squadrons of standard Block 15s with no MLU upgrades and 18 Block 52+



viewtopic.php?f=2&t=45985&p=401414&hilit=Pakistan#p401414

Re: Indian Mirage 2000 hits targets in Pakistan

Unread postPosted: 28 Feb 2019, 01:31
by weasel1962
Basing wise, the new F-16s are based somewhere in the middle of Pakistan so unless these were transferred, they are not in the fight. 9 Sqn (F-16 MLU) is probably the closest F-16 sqns to the LOC. However, the closest fighter sqns are JF+17s incl the 14 sqn based at Minhas.

On India's side, the likely losses are from the 26 Mig-21bison sqn based at Pathankot. Sukhois based at Bareilly (8 sqn) was probably involved. Likely Mig-29s at Adampur as well (although we don't hear anything about Mig-29s). The mIrages are at Gwalior, also in the northern side of India.

Re: Indian Mirage 2000 hits targets in Pakistan

Unread postPosted: 28 Feb 2019, 01:49
by basher54321
Pakistan have posted photos of some of the items the captured pilot had with him including a survival checklist clearly marked 51 squadron with the serial number of the MiG. The tweet above is not from a random tweeter.

Re: Indian Mirage 2000 hits targets in Pakistan

Unread postPosted: 28 Feb 2019, 02:23
by southernphantom
armedupdate wrote:F-16 should be able to take on SU-30 in BVR. Unlike the F-15 which can Mach 2.5, the SU-30 goes the speed speed as the F-16.


:doh: :doh:

That is a gross oversimplification.

Re: Indian Mirage 2000 hits targets in Pakistan

Unread postPosted: 28 Feb 2019, 02:33
by armedupdate
hythelday wrote:
armedupdate wrote:F-16 should be able to take on SU-30 in BVR. Unlike the F-15 which can Mach 2.5, the SU-30 goes the speed speed as the F-16.


Except that F-15 never even came close to Mach 2 in combat operations, but OK.

F-15 has a higher cruise speed.

southernphantom wrote:
armedupdate wrote:F-16 should be able to take on SU-30 in BVR. Unlike the F-15 which can Mach 2.5, the SU-30 goes the speed speed as the F-16.


:doh: :doh:

That is a gross oversimplification.

Why?

Re: Indian Mirage 2000 hits targets in Pakistan

Unread postPosted: 28 Feb 2019, 03:13
by firebase99
armedupdate wrote:
hythelday wrote:
armedupdate wrote:F-16 should be able to take on SU-30 in BVR. Unlike the F-15 which can Mach 2.5, the SU-30 goes the speed speed as the F-16.


Except that F-15 never even came close to Mach 2 in combat operations, but OK.

F-15 has a higher cruise speed.

southernphantom wrote:
armedupdate wrote:F-16 should be able to take on SU-30 in BVR. Unlike the F-15 which can Mach 2.5, the SU-30 goes the speed speed as the F-16.


:doh: :doh:

That is a gross oversimplification.

Why?


Because no 4th gen AC will EVER see speeds anywhere remotely close to manufacture top speed in a combat config. 99% of them will never see it ever.

Re: Indian Mirage 2000 hits targets in Pakistan

Unread postPosted: 28 Feb 2019, 03:34
by awsome
Photos+of+the+mig21+bisons+shot+down+over+pakistan_09bf52_6964768.jpg
A shot of one of the wrecks. The tail looks more like its from a mirage than a Mig 21 to me.

Re: Indian Mirage 2000 hits targets in Pakistan

Unread postPosted: 28 Feb 2019, 03:52
by noth
awsome wrote:
Photos+of+the+mig21+bisons+shot+down+over+pakistan_09bf52_6964768.jpg
A shot of one of the wrecks. The tail looks more like its from a mirage than a Mig 21 to me.


I think it's a Hawk. The tailpipe it too small for a Mirage.

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-Fqf9_7sIU3k/ ... iner_1.jpg

Also none of the photos of crashed aircraft have timestamps, I'm wondering if we're being fed pictures of previous crashes. India's lost several Hawks over the years. Still no picture or video of the Pakistani fighter India claims to have shot down?

Re: Indian Mirage 2000 hits targets in Pakistan

Unread postPosted: 28 Feb 2019, 04:19
by zero-one
Patriot wrote:Bigger radar dish - yes.
More advanced radar in general - likely no.

Isn't the NO11 BARS a Pesa system. I think the Pakistanis still use the MSA APG-68, which pretty small.

Patriot wrote:Id say the AMRAAM is a single most important and key factor in favor of Paks to hold an air superiority over Indians. Whenever an AMRAAM comes off the rail it's asured someome wont go back home that day


Woah I wouldn't go this far. The AMRAAM's Pk currently sits at 60%.... some of those kills are WVR.

Re: Indian Mirage 2000 hits targets in Pakistan

Unread postPosted: 28 Feb 2019, 07:04
by weasel1962
basher54321 wrote:Pakistan have posted photos of some of the items the captured pilot had with him including a survival checklist clearly marked 51 squadron with the serial number of the MiG. The tweet above is not from a random tweeter.


51sqn is based at Srinagar in IOK so very near the LOC. Useful to note the Bison is equipped with the R-77.

Lots of interesting perspectives.
It'd be interesting to see whether it was an SD-10, PL-9 or even an AIM-9.
Regardless, what is the missile, it appears to confirm even the older KLJ-7/JF-17 combo works.
That may boost JF-17 sales. Possible knock on sales for J-10s which the chinese have been claiming house better avionics and missiles.
May even result in IAF asking if the LCA is really good enough....

Re: Indian Mirage 2000 hits targets in Pakistan

Unread postPosted: 28 Feb 2019, 07:13
by weasel1962
noth wrote:I think it's a Hawk. The tailpipe it too small for a Mirage.


Hawks are trainers and unlikely to be based anywhere near the LOC (India's case Chabua/Bidar far awy). Won't be redeployed with fight areas either.

Pictures can be doctored = agreed. However, when pilots are captured, difficult to reject or create propaganda. This especially if you want the other party to treat the prisoner as a POW. Hence India had to acknowledge a Mig-21 Bison shoot down. If the PAF shows 2 pilots, then they will acknowledge 2. Since the air strikes were started by India, Pakistan will not have time to go and find a Mig-21 pilot to "doctor" that part of the info at least.

So I'd read at least 1 confirmed kill for PAF.

Re: Indian Mirage 2000 hits targets in Pakistan

Unread postPosted: 28 Feb 2019, 08:32
by eloise
Does anyone know what jet engine does Pakistan F-16 use?
Indian show the part that looks like it is from F-110 engine:
Capture.PNG

From what i can find Pakistan F-16 is equipped with F-100PW229 and F-100PW200 engine
PAF engine.jpg

F-100 engine.jpg


Nevermind, zoom up, that wreckage doesn't look like F-110 engine either
f110-ge-100_f-16_11_of_17.jpg