Indian Mirage 2000 hits targets in Pakistan

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eloise

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Unread post12 Apr 2019, 10:34

at this point, i don't think anyone other than Indian believe indian shot down F-16
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There is no rivet in that Yugoslavia Mig-21 internal part either.
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vm

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Unread post12 Apr 2019, 11:15

The radar tracks conclusively prove loss of a Pakistani fighter jet. Since mostly f16s were in action, probability of a f16 going down are enormous.
I believe that its a matter of time that either usa or Pakistan will reveal their embarrassing loss.
Remember Pakistan Army has not acknowledged till date loss of over 4000 soldiers in kargil but their PM revealed it. What is a single plane in comparison.?
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Shimud

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Unread post12 Apr 2019, 11:25

Loss of an F-16 is in fact a gain for Pakistan. A blessing in disguise.
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Shimud

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Unread post12 Apr 2019, 11:30

pagan wrote:There is clear evidence about F-16 parts in PAF Green on the Ground...
...If you are color-blind, please ask someone else who is not (color blindness is related to consanguineous marriage which is very prevalent in Pakistan)


Leave an F-16 or a MiG-21 aside, you don't know your a_s from a hole in the ground.
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basher54321

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Unread post12 Apr 2019, 12:22

Corsair1963 wrote:Indian Radar Data That Supposedly Proves They Downed An F-16 Is Far From "Irrefutable"

India's evidence doesn't come anywhere close to definitively proving what did and did not happen during the air battle over Kashmir in February.



They are correct - irrefutable was the wrong word - perhaps the IAF need a better translator because what was shown barely expands on what they had already verbally claimed. In Indian Journalist who was in the press brief said it better - strong circumstantial evidence.

The fact is there is nothing shown (including any of the wreckage photos shown so far) to conclusively say that Pakistan are lying.

Both sides PR departments would have done well to delay their initial press releases because of the misinformation they themselves were also subject to at the time.

Next round please....
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Asif

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Unread post12 Apr 2019, 12:22

vm wrote:The radar tracks conclusively prove loss of a Pakistani fighter jet. Since mostly f16s were in action, probability of a f16 going down are enormous.


So you know what a F-16 Radar track looks like??
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vm

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Unread post12 Apr 2019, 15:53

Asif wrote:
vm wrote:The radar tracks conclusively prove loss of a Pakistani fighter jet. Since mostly f16s were in action, probability of a f16 going down are enormous.


So you know what a F-16 Radar track looks like??

I don't need to. Frankly I trust our professional defense services any day over your Pakistani ones, as ours don't need to run a country with a infallible narrative. The Ispr gen has already changed his official statement so many times that no one knows what to believe.
If you have any analysis of the radar images released, this is the right forum.
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Shimud

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Unread post12 Apr 2019, 19:11

vm wrote:...Frankly I trust our professional defense services any day over your Pakistani ones...


Frankly speaking, the professionals got their ar-es spanked.

- Mirages missed targets. Brought a bad name for Israeli ammo they used.
Lied about the losses on ground.
- Lost a MiG-21 and probably a Su-30 also (though Pakistanis are rightly not eager to claim the later).
- Own goal chopper killing 6 servicemen.
- Air Office Commanding of the specific sector fired.
- Didn't manage to down a single Pakistani jet, out of the 24 claimed to have attacked the Indian targets.
- Yet to show a single piece of concrete evidence that they have downed an F-16.

Professionals have performed rather remarkably.
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vm

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Unread post13 Apr 2019, 00:11

Shimud wrote:
vm wrote:...Frankly I trust our professional defense services any day over your Pakistani ones...


Frankly speaking, the professionals got their ar-es spanked.

- Mirages missed targets. Brought a bad name for Israeli ammo they used.
Lied about the losses on ground.
- Lost a MiG-21 and probably a Su-30 also (though Pakistanis are rightly not eager to claim the later).
- Own goal chopper killing 6 servicemen.
- Air Office Commanding of the specific sector fired.
- Didn't manage to down a single Pakistani jet, out of the 24 claimed to have attacked the Indian targets.
- Yet to show a single piece of concrete evidence that they have downed an F-16.

Professionals have performed rather remarkably.

All this obsessive propaganda leads me to believe that the losses suffered by pakistan are quite substantial.
If the balakot bombing was unsuccessful then why a 17 min visit after 40 days ?
Sudden disappearance from radar is a classic sign of being shot down. Pakistan did lose a plane.
Also telling that the only senior officer decorated in the recent army parade was the ispr head.
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pagan

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Unread post13 Apr 2019, 06:49

This is from a government owned Indian channel (RS TV => TV for Upper House of Parliament).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZuWNE1n4cs

Asif wrote:
vm wrote:The radar tracks conclusively prove loss of a Pakistani fighter jet. Since mostly f16s were in action, probability of a f16 going down are enormous.


So you know what a F-16 Radar track looks like??


The Israel Aerospace Industries who built the Phalcon know what an F-16 radar track looks like.

https://twitter.com/anshumig/status/1111248701811359744
https://twitter.com/anshumig/status/1111249940892647426

The dark color smooth piece with the opening for the tailhook, the tailhook like appendage on the ground, the rush in which this debris field was cleared (the Mig21 was open for locals to take pictures till late in night), ISPR and PM claiming two planes shot down, and multiple pilots captured, the videos showing two planes going down...

The evidence keeps piling up, and up.

Shimud wrote:
pagan wrote:There is clear evidence about F-16 parts in PAF Green on the Ground...
...If you are color-blind, please ask someone else who is not (color blindness is related to consanguineous marriage which is very prevalent in Pakistan)


Leave an F-16 or a MiG-21 aside, you don't know your a_s from a hole in the ground.


The previous one called me idiot for starting where bellingcat left off.

:devil: :mrgreen:

Every action has a reaction; and that includes consanguineous marriages. There is a reason why many Indian communities do not permit marriages within the same gotra.
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skumar7777

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Unread post14 Apr 2019, 16:35

Asif wrote:So you know what a F-16 Radar track looks like??


We do not need to, the IAF does and the Israelis, who operate F16s and manufactured the Phalcons used by the IAF that detected the F16s, do.

But as an Editor on a F16 forum, you are not aware of this.
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Corsair1963

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Unread post15 Apr 2019, 01:09

vm wrote:The radar tracks conclusively prove loss of a Pakistani fighter jet. Since mostly f16s were in action, probability of a f16 going down are enormous.
I believe that its a matter of time that either usa or Pakistan will reveal their embarrassing loss.
Remember Pakistan Army has not acknowledged till date loss of over 4000 soldiers in kargil but their PM revealed it. What is a single plane in comparison.?



You need to cut back on the Medication. As I don't know anymore with any real knowledge of the subject matter. That believe that Pakistan lost an F-16....

This is not because I am a supporter of Pakistan over India. To the contrary.....Yet, the facts are the facts. :doh:


As a matter of fact the only ones that do. Are Indian's that are blinded by bias, prejudice, and pride. Time to accept the truth and learn from it....
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mixelflick

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Unread post18 Apr 2019, 13:04

US: All Pak F-16's accounted for..

https://warisboring.com/all-of-pakistan ... an-claims/

"“As details come out, it looks worse and worse for the Indians,” Narang said. “It looks increasingly like India failed to impose significant costs on Pakistan, but lost a plane and a helicopter of its own in the process.”

So if they're lying about this, could they also be lying about losing an SU-30? Seems more and more possible. At this point, the IAF needs to take a long, hard look in the mirror. Despite having much greater numbers and better training, India's fleet of aging fighters (and even their modern SU-30MKI's) appear to be suspect.

Something tells me the F-21's stock just went up..
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basher54321

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Unread post18 Apr 2019, 13:22

Always read the date of an article Mixelflick - if you go back to page 28 of this thread you will see what the last pages were about.
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mixelflick

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Unread post18 Apr 2019, 14:15

basher54321 wrote:Always read the date of an article Mixelflick - if you go back to page 28 of this thread you will see what the last pages were about.


Well, I went back 3 pages... and saw the issue of the F-16 shootdown still being debated.

In any case, this doesn't look good for India. More and more evidence suggests they made a poor showing, and I take no solace in that - I'm a huge Flanker fan. But facts are facts, and the SU-30MKI IMO failed to rise to the challenge. Even if one wasn't shot down, it should have been more of a factor. India's own reporting says they were in the mix, and all available evidence suggests they weren't the scary super-fighters that's sometimes attributed to it.

Curious how this will affect the upcoming Indian fighter evaluations. If we do get confirmation a Flanker was shot down, it would be interesting to know the circumstances. I'm sure the IAF is doing a lot of soul searching at this very moment..
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