F-15X: USAF Seems Interested

Military aircraft - Post cold war aircraft, including for example B-2, Gripen, F-18E/F Super Hornet, Rafale, and Typhoon.
  • Author
  • Message
Offline
User avatar

sferrin

Elite 5K

Elite 5K

  • Posts: 5563
  • Joined: 22 Jul 2005, 03:23

Unread post27 Jun 2020, 15:30

marauder2048 wrote:An IRST on JLENS would be useful. There's just been a reluctance to cut loose with SAMs,
in a peacetime "bolt-from-the-blue" scenario if you can't positively ID the inbound targets.

But maybe the supersonic nature of the threat relaxes the need to ID.
If not, I come back to one of the low-cost interceptor solutions that had an IIR seeker
that could stream back images to a controller.


If it's a supersonic target it's almost a 100% certainty not a friendly. Also it's not something you wouldn't want to cheap out it defending against.
"There I was. . ."
Offline

marauder2048

Elite 1K

Elite 1K

  • Posts: 1011
  • Joined: 14 Mar 2012, 06:46

Unread post29 Jun 2020, 17:46

sferrin wrote:
marauder2048 wrote:An IRST on JLENS would be useful. There's just been a reluctance to cut loose with SAMs,
in a peacetime "bolt-from-the-blue" scenario if you can't positively ID the inbound targets.

But maybe the supersonic nature of the threat relaxes the need to ID.
If not, I come back to one of the low-cost interceptor solutions that had an IIR seeker
that could stream back images to a controller.


If it's a supersonic target it's almost a 100% certainty not a friendly. Also it's not something you wouldn't want to cheap out it defending against.


The problem is that we do have friendly aircraft going supersonic to intercept airliners.
But I agree, a large stream raid is probably unmistakable.
Offline

wrightwing

Elite 3K

Elite 3K

  • Posts: 3547
  • Joined: 23 Oct 2008, 15:22

Unread post29 Jun 2020, 20:22

marauder2048 wrote:






The problem is that we do have friendly aircraft going supersonic to intercept airliners.
But I agree, a large stream raid is probably unmistakable.

Yes, but we don't have unknown friendly aircraft making supersonic intercepts. We also aren't worried about supersonic targets heading away from the coast.
Offline

marauder2048

Elite 1K

Elite 1K

  • Posts: 1011
  • Joined: 14 Mar 2012, 06:46

Unread post29 Jun 2020, 21:18

wrightwing wrote:
marauder2048 wrote:
The problem is that we do have friendly aircraft going supersonic to intercept airliners.
But I agree, a large stream raid is probably unmistakable.

Yes, but we don't have unknown friendly aircraft making supersonic intercepts. We also aren't worried about supersonic targets heading away from the coast.


I think you are imputing greater confidence to the Single Integrated Air Picture in peacetime than the Army ever has.

There's no way the Army is lobbing SAMs at unknown supersonic targets in peacetime absent a non-radar ID unless there's
already an attack underway because the natural response to unknown contacts would be to launch fighters.

And the typical goal of these decapitation attacks is to not present like a large raid.
Offline

Corsair1963

Elite 5K

Elite 5K

  • Posts: 6634
  • Joined: 19 Dec 2005, 04:14

Unread post01 Jul 2020, 03:46

GE lands $101.3M to build engines for F-15EX aircraft

June 30 (UPI) -- General Electric was awarded $101.3 million to produce engines for F-15EX aircraft for the Air Force, the Pentagon announced Tuesday.

The deal funds the purchase and delivery of F110-GE-129 engines for the aircraft.

That includes installs, spare parts and monitoring engine monitoring system computers, according to the Department of Defense.

In 2019 a Pentagon budget estimate showed that the Air Force intended to spend nearly $7.9 billion over a five-year period to procure 80 F-15EX aircraft to replace its aging F-15 fleet.

The F-15EX is based on the F-15QA fighters Boeing has been contracted to produce for Qatar's military, the Air Force said.

The newer plane is designed to handle a crew of up to two people and include the Eagle Passive Active Warning and Survivability System and the Suite 9.1 Operational Flight Program software.

Work on the contract will be performed at GE's Cincinnati worksite and has an expected completion date of Nov. 30, 2022.

https://www.upi.com/Defense-News/2020/0 ... 760/?ur3=1


Considering the existing fleet of F-15E's use the P&W F100 series. I'm not sure the value of buying the GE F110's for the F-15EX???
Offline

wrightwing

Elite 3K

Elite 3K

  • Posts: 3547
  • Joined: 23 Oct 2008, 15:22

Unread post01 Jul 2020, 05:53

marauder2048 wrote:
wrightwing wrote:
marauder2048 wrote:
The problem is that we do have friendly aircraft going supersonic to intercept airliners.
But I agree, a large stream raid is probably unmistakable.

Yes, but we don't have unknown friendly aircraft making supersonic intercepts. We also aren't worried about supersonic targets heading away from the coast.


I think you are imputing greater confidence to the Single Integrated Air Picture in peacetime than the Army ever has.

There's no way the Army is lobbing SAMs at unknown supersonic targets in peacetime absent a non-radar ID unless there's
already an attack underway because the natural response to unknown contacts would be to launch fighters.

And the typical goal of these decapitation attacks is to not present like a large raid.

I'm inputting confidence in LTAMDS + IBCS + MDC2 + F-22/35. We're way past 9/11/01 in situational awareness capabilities.
Offline

wrightwing

Elite 3K

Elite 3K

  • Posts: 3547
  • Joined: 23 Oct 2008, 15:22

Unread post01 Jul 2020, 05:58

Corsair1963 wrote:GE lands $101.3M to build engines for F-15EX aircraft

June 30 (UPI) -- General Electric was awarded $101.3 million to produce engines for F-15EX aircraft for the Air Force, the Pentagon announced Tuesday.

The deal funds the purchase and delivery of F110-GE-129 engines for the aircraft.

That includes installs, spare parts and monitoring engine monitoring system computers, according to the Department of Defense.

In 2019 a Pentagon budget estimate showed that the Air Force intended to spend nearly $7.9 billion over a five-year period to procure 80 F-15EX aircraft to replace its aging F-15 fleet.

The F-15EX is based on the F-15QA fighters Boeing has been contracted to produce for Qatar's military, the Air Force said.

The newer plane is designed to handle a crew of up to two people and include the Eagle Passive Active Warning and Survivability System and the Suite 9.1 Operational Flight Program software.

Work on the contract will be performed at GE's Cincinnati worksite and has an expected completion date of Nov. 30, 2022.

https://www.upi.com/Defense-News/2020/0 ... 760/?ur3=1


Considering the existing fleet of F-15E's use the P&W F100 series. I'm not sure the value of buying the GE F110's for the F-15EX???

The USAF is looking at buying 480 engines. Presumably, older F-15s would be upgraded, along with engines for the EX models.
Offline

Corsair1963

Elite 5K

Elite 5K

  • Posts: 6634
  • Joined: 19 Dec 2005, 04:14

Unread post01 Jul 2020, 06:58

wrightwing wrote:
The USAF is looking at buying 480 engines. Presumably, older F-15s would be upgraded, along with engines for the EX models.


So, the older F-15E's are going to be upgraded with the New F110's???
Offline
User avatar

sferrin

Elite 5K

Elite 5K

  • Posts: 5563
  • Joined: 22 Jul 2005, 03:23

Unread post01 Jul 2020, 13:47

Corsair1963 wrote:
wrightwing wrote:
The USAF is looking at buying 480 engines. Presumably, older F-15s would be upgraded, along with engines for the EX models.


So, the older F-15E's are going to be upgraded with the New F110's???


Put some in the Streak Eagle and go get some records back. :D
"There I was. . ."
Offline

f119doctor

Enthusiast

Enthusiast

  • Posts: 79
  • Joined: 13 Mar 2019, 00:07

Unread post01 Jul 2020, 15:45

Apparently, this $100M contract for the GE-129 is just for Lot 1 of the F-15EX. Competition will occur for follow-on production lots (if any)

https://www.janes.com/defence-news/news ... ompetition
P&W FSR (retired) - TF30 / F100 /F119 /F135
Offline

mixelflick

Elite 3K

Elite 3K

  • Posts: 3954
  • Joined: 20 Mar 2010, 10:26
  • Location: Parts Unknown

Unread post01 Jul 2020, 16:15

Corsair1963 wrote:
wrightwing wrote:
The USAF is looking at buying 480 engines. Presumably, older F-15s would be upgraded, along with engines for the EX models.


So, the older F-15E's are going to be upgraded with the New F110's???


That's a good question.... what "older" F-15's will get these new engines?

I would think the obvious answer would be F-15C's, as their F-100's are old, tired and increasingly difficult to maintain. Engines in F-15E's would logically be newer, and if I'm not mistaken no small number have F-100-229's. Unless... F-15EX's will replace F-15C's 1:1 in their air to air role? I understand we have around 200 though, and the biggest number of F-15EX's I've seen thrown around is 144.

I still haven't seen any clear cut guidance on what happens to ALL the F-15C's. Unless I've missed something, they (USAF) hasn't said definitively what'll happen to them. That would make sense to me, as the (full) EX buy isn't funded yet - and anything could happen between now and then.

Which is probably smart - have as many of these bigger, more powerful engines around as you can, to stick in whatever airframes you wind up with...
Offline

sprstdlyscottsmn

Elite 4K

Elite 4K

  • Posts: 4793
  • Joined: 10 Mar 2006, 01:24
  • Location: Phoenix, Az, USA

Unread post01 Jul 2020, 17:03

You are mistaken. IIRC less than 1/3 of F-15Es have -229s. Most have -220s.
"Spurts"

-Pilot
-Aerospace Engineer
-Army Medic
-FMS Systems Engineer
Offline
User avatar

jetblast16

Forum Veteran

Forum Veteran

  • Posts: 682
  • Joined: 23 Aug 2004, 00:12
  • Location: USA

Unread post01 Jul 2020, 18:32

Too bad they aren't GE-132s. Does anyone know when they will start cutting metal on the first jets?
Have F110, Block 70, will travel
Offline

marauder2048

Elite 1K

Elite 1K

  • Posts: 1011
  • Joined: 14 Mar 2012, 06:46

Unread post01 Jul 2020, 18:43

wrightwing wrote:I'm inputting confidence in LTAMDS + IBCS + MDC2 + F-22/35. We're way past 9/11/01 in situational awareness capabilities.


And when (if?) those are actually incorporated into the National Capital Region - Integrated Air Defense System
we may have confidence. But I think the only thing you'll see in the near-term is Sentinel A4 and AMRAAM-ER.
Offline

aaam

Forum Veteran

Forum Veteran

  • Posts: 935
  • Joined: 21 Aug 2010, 22:52

Unread post01 Jul 2020, 22:32

mixelflick wrote:
Corsair1963 wrote:
wrightwing wrote:
The USAF is looking at buying 480 engines. Presumably, older F-15s would be upgraded, along with engines for the EX models.


So, the older F-15E's are going to be upgraded with the New F110's???


That's a good question.... what "older" F-15's will get these new engines?

I would think the obvious answer would be F-15C's, as their F-100's are old, tired and increasingly difficult to maintain. Engines in F-15E's would logically be newer, and if I'm not mistaken no small number have F-100-229's. Unless... F-15EX's will replace F-15C's 1:1 in their air to air role? I understand we have around 200 though, and the biggest number of F-15EX's I've seen thrown around is 144.

I still haven't seen any clear cut guidance on what happens to ALL the F-15C's. Unless I've missed something, they (USAF) hasn't said definitively what'll happen to them. That would make sense to me, as the (full) EX buy isn't funded yet - and anything could happen between now and then.

Which is probably smart - have as many of these bigger, more powerful engines around as you can, to stick in whatever airframes you wind up with...



Problem is, the F-15Cs themselves are old, and would require extensive and expensive structural rebuilding if they are going to stay in service. That's one of the prime reasons, their wearing out and not going to be available all that much longer, that the F-15EX program is going forward. Plus, mounting these 26% more powerful engines would require even more extensive reinforcement. A final factor is that the F-15C does not have the so-called "common engine bay" of later F-15s and most F-16s. This means further rework and modification. Probably just not worth it.


Regarding USAF F-15Es (as opposed to later export models): I don't think they have the common engine bay either. So while probably having less issues than the C, it would still be a major undertaking. Better to just put the bigger Pratts in.
Last edited by aaam on 02 Jul 2020, 01:40, edited 1 time in total.
PreviousNext

Return to Modern Military Aircraft

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot], Google Adsense [Bot] and 33 guests