The V-22 Osprey

[neptune]

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... sh-440174/

MV-22 struck flight deck before fatal crash

10 August, 2017 SOURCE:
BY: Leigh Giangreco

A US Marine Corps Bell Boeing MV-22 struck the flight deck of an amphibious transport dock before crashing into waters off the coast of East Australia on 5 August, a US Navy document shows. The tilt rotor launched that evening from the amphibious carrier USS Bonhomme Richard during a joint exercise with the Australian navy, carrying 26 Marines on board. But the Osprey hit the US Navy's 25,000t-class USS Green Bay during its final approach in the Shoalwater Bay Training Area, Queensland, Australia. After the collision, the MV-22 crashed into the water, a 9 August safety report states. The Marines declared three men on board the MV-22 dead on 7 August after calling off search rescue efforts in waters 15.6nm (18mi) off the Queensland coast.. The Green Bay and other ships rescued the other 23 Marines on board the aircraft. The Marines have since lifted a grounding order on all aircraft in the 31st Marine Expeditionary Unit, including the MV-22s. The cause of the crash remains under investigation.

The incident is part of a rash of accidents sweeping the Marines' aviation fleet this year and stoking a spike in Class A mishaps, which incur either deaths or excessive damage. Earlier this July, a Marine Forces Reserve-operated Lockheed Martin KC-130T crashed, leaving 16 Marines dead. Twelve USMC KC-130Ts remain grounded. Updated data from 10 August shows a Class A mishap rate of 4.56 per 100,000 flight hours to date from the beginning of Fiscal 2017, according to data posted online by the Navy Safety Center. Marine aircraft compiled a Class A mishap rate of 3.42 during the same period in fiscal 2016.

[aaam]

Very early word is that it came in too low and fast; not confirmed yet. Emphasizes the need for more proficiency hours for our crews. This kind of accident is not confined to the Osprey.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CdlqCeQfGmo

[charlielima223]

The V-22 has come a long way over the years. Derided as a death trap in earlier years and was seen as too complex and unreliable.


Now its become a valuable work horse for SOF. Japan is now going to become a user for their new "carrier". Now a new version for the USN for a long awaited replacement for the venerable C2 Greyhound.
https://breakingdefense.com/2020/02/nav ... -it-means/

The first CMV-22B aircraft was delivered Friday to the Navy, where it will replace the C2A Greyhound, the venerable tail-hook aircraft that has flown on and off aircraft carriers since 1966.

A second Osprey arrived at Pax River the week before for the final round of testing. The fleet of Navy Ospreys should be operational within six years from contract to delivery carrying out a much wider array of roles than the old Greyhounds executed. They’ll be flying VIPs and crew back and forth, as do the venerable CODs, but they will also do search and rescue and support for Naval Special Warfare.
***
The aircraft differs from the Marine Corps and Air Force versions, boasting an enhanced fuel capacity which required wing modifications to deal with the greater weight. There is another key aspect. The CMV-22, unlike the C-2, can carry an F-35C engine onboard a carrier. In 2015, I was onboard the USS Wasp when an Osprey brought an engine onboard the ship to prove the capability; The Navy signed its first contract for the CMV-22 program that same year.

An F-35B pilot is now head of the Osprey program at Pax River. Col. Matthew “Squirt” Kelly told me in an interview last fall about the impact of broadening the plane’s set of users around the world:

“There is no other air platform that has the breadth of aircraft laydown across the world than does the V-22. And now that breadth is expanding with the inclusion of the carrier fleet and the Japanese. We currently have a sustainment system which works but we need to make it better in terms of supporting global operations. With the US Navy onboard to operate the Osprey as well, we will see greater momentum to improve the supply chain.”

More stuff
https://www.flightglobal.com/helicopter ... 79.article

[noth]

Meanwhile, Israel can't afford a fleet of V-22s for the time being:

The Israel Air Force will not be procuring Boeing’s V-22 Osprey due to budgetary issues, The Jerusalem Post has learned.
While the military believes there is an operational need for between 12 and 14 aircraft that can take off and land like helicopters but fly like fixed-wing planes, there are not enough funds to procure the tilt-rotor aircraft.
The V-22 is designed for sensitive, extensive missions during times of war and for routine use.
The IAF is modernizing its squadrons of aging fighter jets and helicopters and believes there needs to be a mix of heavy-lift helicopters and the V-22, a defense source told the Post last year.
As part of the new procurements funded in large part by the Memorandum of Understanding signed between Jerusalem and Washington, which would see Israel receive $38 billion in military assistance over the next decade, Israel has purchased two squadrons of F-35 Adir stealth fighters and is currently deciding between Boeing’s Chinook or Lockheed Martin’s CH-53K heavy-lift helicopters.

https://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Its-o ... -22-617510

[charlielima223]

I know many here focus on fixed winged fighter aircraft but I am surprised no one mentioned this

V-22s are currently grounded due to safety concerns...

https://breakingdefense.com/2023/12/air ... off-japan/

Despite the groundings V-22s on active deployment operations are still being used...

https://news.usni.org/2023/12/07/uss-ca ... -navy-says

https://news.usni.org/2023/12/15/marine ... s-continue

I'm sure this will have a negative impact on how the V-280 is seen as both are tilt rotor designs by the same company (albeit V-280 is a newer more refined design).

[aaam]

I know many here focus on fixed winged fighter aircraft but I am surprised no one mentioned this

V-22s are currently grounded due to safety concerns...


I'm sure this will have a negative impact on how the V-280 is seen as both are tilt rotor designs by the same company (albeit V-280 is a newer more refined design).

Sadly, I fear you're right. Even though the V-22's record isn't that different from other craft, and more importantly, although the crashes have been not linked to the Tilt-Rotor technology itself, the perception will still be there.

[daswp]

I'll wait for the AIB results to come out before getting worked up over tilt rotor safety.

[charlielima223]

Still not looking good...

Timeline on returning Ospreys to flight remains murky, Air Force says
https://www.defensenews.com/news/your-a ... orce-says/

[laos]

Is Osprey the most lethal helicopter for its crews and passengers in the U.S. armed forces' inventory say for 100,000 flight hours?

[daswp]

Is Osprey the most lethal helicopter for its crews and passengers in the U.S. armed forces' inventory say for 100,000 flight hours?

Probably not.
Blackhawks had quite the reputation "back in the day".

[usafhk]

Is Osprey the most lethal helicopter for its crews and passengers in the U.S. armed forces' inventory say for 100,000 flight hours?

Probably not.
Blackhawks had quite the reputation "back in the day".

From the USAF Safety Center 28 December 2021. These stats do not include any mishaps from this date to today.

H-60 10 year fatal rate per 100,00 flight hours was 5.52.
Total deaths since 2000 26.
https://www.safety.af.mil/Portals/71/documents/Aviation/Aircraft%20Statistics/H-60.pdf

CV-22 10 year fatal rate per 100,00 flight hours was 0.
Total deaths since 2000 4.
https://www.safety.af.mil/Portals/71/documents/Aviation/Aircraft%20Statistics/V-22.pdf

[wrightwing]

Is Osprey the most lethal helicopter for its crews and passengers in the U.S. armed forces' inventory say for 100,000 flight hours?

No, it's actually one of the safest, per 100,000 flight hours.

[charlielima223]

Well it looks like someone progress is being made.

https://www.airandspaceforces.com/afsoc ... -what-why/

[charlielima223]

https://www.defensenews.com/news/your-m ... rce-crash/

This part I find a tad but concerning..

The Air Force has said that it has identified what failed in the Japan crash, even though it does not know yet why it failed.

Is it bad QC? Unforseen excessive wear and tear? Worse yet is it an oversight in the design that leads to failure?

Statistically speaking V-22s are not more dangerous than their traditional rotary-winged counterparts. Unfortunately, however, it is seemingly when one crashes it is often with the most injuries and fatalities and garnishes the most attention.

[daswp]

https://www.defensenews.com/news/your-military/2024/03/01/pentagon-to-lift-osprey-flight-ban-after-fatal-air-force-crash/

This part I find a tad but concerning..

The Air Force has said that it has identified what failed in the Japan crash, even though it does not know yet why it failed.

Is it bad QC? Unforseen excessive wear and tear? Worse yet is it an oversight in the design that leads to failure?

Statistically speaking V-22s are not more dangerous than their traditional rotary-winged counterparts. Unfortunately, however, it is seemingly when one crashes it is often with the most injuries and fatalities and garnishes the most attention.

This is concerning, why are they not stating what failed? I understand it could be an OpSec issue, but if it is then the Osprey program has a major issue.