Iraqi AF victories during operation Desert Storm

Cold war, Korea, Vietnam, and Desert Storm - up to and including for example the A-10, F-15, Mirage 200, MiG-29, and F-18.
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tomcooper

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Unread post23 Sep 2015, 10:40

oldiaf wrote:Both Rodriguez claims are disputed ... Jan 19 MiG-29 Pilot Qasim Khalaf Hamad denies he was shut downed or crashed into the ground ... While MiG-23 of Jan 26 ( well the USAF claimed 3 MiG-23s to be shut downed while in fact they were 2 ).
Did I say anything else?

You should keep in mind, that Rodriguez scored a confirmed kill (MiG-29) over Serbia, in 1999, though.

So, when I say 'two of his claims', I mean also 'two out of three'.

Corsair1963 wrote:Do you even know who Tom Cooper is??? :doh:
It doesn't matter who I am or what I did.

...and I gave up expectations for any Iraqis to ever do anything more but scan pages from 'Iraqi Fighters' and post them around the internet.

(Why read the 'Arab MiGs' series and learn about history of their own air force, for example...?)

So, doesn't matter.

oldiaf wrote:The information I have comes from my sources.

...primarily from ex-IrAF FB and memorial site...
F-Arba-Ashara!! Yalla, yalla!!
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oldiaf

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Unread post23 Sep 2015, 10:48

tomcooper wrote:
oldiaf wrote:Both Rodriguez claims are disputed ... Jan 19 MiG-29 Pilot Qasim Khalaf Hamad denies he was shut downed or crashed into the ground ... While MiG-23 of Jan 26 ( well the USAF claimed 3 MiG-23s to be shut downed while in fact they were 2 ).
Did I say anything else?

You should keep in mind, that Rodriguez scored a confirmed kill (MiG-29) over Serbia, in 1999, though.

So, when I say 'two of his claims', I mean also 'two out of three'.

Corsair1963 wrote:Do you even know who Tom Cooper is??? :doh:
It doesn't matter who I am or what I did.

...and I gave up expectations for any Iraqis to ever do anything more but scan pages from 'Iraqi Fighters' and post them around the internet.

(Why read the 'Arab MiGs' series and learn about history of their own air force, for example...?)

So, doesn't matter.

oldiaf wrote:The information I have comes from my sources.

...primarily from ex-IrAF FB and memorial site...

Yes ... Rodrigues killed a Serb MiG-29 in 1999 with AMRAAM ....
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han9

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Unread post24 Oct 2015, 20:15

Regarding Iraqi AF air to air victories, including damaged aircraft, there is info floating around the web, this forum including, that a few F 111 were damaged. Can these claims be linked to specific USAF aircraft that were actually damaged i.e. US sources confirm damage to them (even if attribute that damage to other causes)?

PS
Tom please kindly do not reply as I know your opinion on this one from elsewhere :wink:
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oldiaf

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Unread post24 Oct 2015, 20:28

han9 wrote:Regarding Iraqi AF air to air victories, including damaged aircraft, there is info floating around the web, this forum including, that a few F 111 were damaged. Can these claims be linked to specific USAF aircraft that were actually damaged i.e. US sources confirm damage to them (even if attribute that damage to other causes)?

PS
Tom please kindly do not reply as I know your opinion on this one from elsewhere :wink:

Jan 17 1991
3 F-111F from 48th TFW damaged 1 by MiG-29A using R-60MK - IrAF squadron 6 ... 1 by MiG-23ML using R-24T - IrAF squadron 63 ... another F-111F was damaged by another MiG-23ML using R-24T - IrAF Squadron 63 .....
USAF 48 TFW claimed 2 were damaged by AAA and 1 in a refueling accident .
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han9

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Unread post25 Oct 2015, 12:11

OK - what is your opinion about the F 111 which lost its tailfin and was AFAIK subsequently written off. A possible victim of Iraqi MiGs?
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oldiaf

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Unread post25 Oct 2015, 13:29

han9 wrote:OK - what is your opinion about the F 111 which lost its tailfin and was AFAIK subsequently written off. A possible victim of Iraqi MiGs?

Could be one of these 3 mentioned above ?!
Btw do you know the date of that particular F-111 ?
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han9

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Unread post25 Oct 2015, 13:43

There was somewhere on the net info about this F 111 which lost its tailfin during DS and was subsequently written off but I just can not find it right now.

However while I was searching for that I found something else that is of interest.

Namely:

EF-111A 66-0023 13 Feb 91. Saudi Arabia. Capt. Douglas L. Bradt and Capt. Paul R. Eichenlaub. Callsign RATCHET 75. Speculation of flight into terrain at night avoiding air to air threat displayed on the threat radar warning receiver upon entering Iraqi airspace. An ejection was attempted. It has been reported that F-15s in the vicinity witnessed the EF-111A manourvering and dispensing countermeasures immediately prior to terrain impact.(XX)
Both Capt. Douglas L. Bradt & Capt. Paul R. Eichenlaub received Distinguished Flying Crosses and Purple Hearts for "their gallantry in combat". (DFC citation)
The EF-111 (66-0016) on static display at Cannon AFB has the names Capt. Douglas L. Bradt (Aircraft Commander) and Capt. Paul R. Eichenlaub (EWO) adorning the cockpit as a memorial to their heroism.

The source for this is:

http://f-111.net/F-111A/combat-ops.htm

Unfortunately F-111.net is ‘dying’ i.e. since years it is no longer updated and some things like image enlargement and similar features do not work anymore.
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oldiaf

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Unread post25 Oct 2015, 15:00

han9 wrote:There was somewhere on the net info about this F 111 which lost its tailfin during DS and was subsequently written off but I just can not find it right now.

However while I was searching for that I found something else that is of interest.

Namely:

EF-111A 66-0023 13 Feb 91. Saudi Arabia. Capt. Douglas L. Bradt and Capt. Paul R. Eichenlaub. Callsign RATCHET 75. Speculation of flight into terrain at night avoiding air to air threat displayed on the threat radar warning receiver upon entering Iraqi airspace. An ejection was attempted. It has been reported that F-15s in the vicinity witnessed the EF-111A manourvering and dispensing countermeasures immediately prior to terrain impact.(XX)
Both Capt. Douglas L. Bradt & Capt. Paul R. Eichenlaub received Distinguished Flying Crosses and Purple Hearts for "their gallantry in combat". (DFC citation)
The EF-111 (66-0016) on static display at Cannon AFB has the names Capt. Douglas L. Bradt (Aircraft Commander) and Capt. Paul R. Eichenlaub (EWO) adorning the cockpit as a memorial to their heroism.

The source for this is:

http://f-111.net/F-111A/combat-ops.htm

Unfortunately F-111.net is ‘dying’ i.e. since years it is no longer updated and some things like image enlargement and similar features do not work anymore.

Iraqi AF claimed a Mirage F.1EQ downed EF-111A in the first night of the war Jan 17 1991 ... The Mirage used one heat seeking missile and it was from Squadron 79 ... The USAF only admitted this lose on Feb 13 1991 .
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han9

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Unread post25 Oct 2015, 15:59

Let me put it this way - I am not entierly convinced. At least one 'Raven' crew reported avoiding an AAM on 17 Jan and that is what probably corresponds with the Iraqi claim. The Feb incident appears to be a different one.

IMHO it would be more instructive to have some details on damaged and possibly written off (if any that is) F 111 of the 48 TFW and tha compare them with Iraqi claims.
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Unread post25 Oct 2015, 16:30

han9 wrote:Let me put it this way - I am not entierly convinced. At least one 'Raven' crew reported avoiding an AAM on 17 Jan and that is what probably corresponds with the Iraqi claim. The Feb incident appears to be a different one.

IMHO it would be more instructive to have some details on damaged and possibly written off (if any that is) F 111 of the 48 TFW and tha compare them with Iraqi claims.

The other EF-111A that reported evading missile is the same one that crashed what he thought a Mirage F.1EQ to the ground ( with assistance from F-15C ) ... Iraqi sources mention a MiG-23ML from Squadron 73 that was crashed to the ground
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old.iraqi.air.force

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Unread post25 Oct 2015, 19:44

oldiaf wrote:
han9 wrote:Let me put it this way - I am not entierly convinced. At least one 'Raven' crew reported avoiding an AAM on 17 Jan and that is what probably corresponds with the Iraqi claim. The Feb incident appears to be a different one.

IMHO it would be more instructive to have some details on damaged and possibly written off (if any that is) F 111 of the 48 TFW and tha compare them with Iraqi claims.

The other EF-111A that reported evading missile is the same one that crashed what he thought a Mirage F.1EQ to the ground ( with assistance from F-15C ) ... Iraqi sources mention a MiG-23ML from Squadron 73 that was crashed to the ground

What Iraqi sources mentioned that we lost MIG-23ML crashed to the ground? I've never heard or seen any of our sources mention this statement since it's never happened..!
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oldiaf

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Unread post25 Oct 2015, 19:53

old.iraqi.air.force wrote:
oldiaf wrote:
han9 wrote:Let me put it this way - I am not entierly convinced. At least one 'Raven' crew reported avoiding an AAM on 17 Jan and that is what probably corresponds with the Iraqi claim. The Feb incident appears to be a different one.

IMHO it would be more instructive to have some details on damaged and possibly written off (if any that is) F 111 of the 48 TFW and tha compare them with Iraqi claims.

The other EF-111A that reported evading missile is the same one that crashed what he thought a Mirage F.1EQ to the ground ( with assistance from F-15C ) ... Iraqi sources mention a MiG-23ML from Squadron 73 that was crashed to the ground

What Iraqi sources mentioned that we lost MIG-23ML crashed to the ground? I've never heard or seen any of our sources mention this statement since it's never happened..!

The same one claimed to be crashed for unknown reason ... I don't buy the idea of fratricide SAM kill
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old.iraqi.air.force

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Unread post25 Oct 2015, 20:22

oldiaf wrote:The other EF-111A that reported evading missile is the same one that crashed what he thought a Mirage F.1EQ to the ground ( with assistance from F-15C ) ... Iraqi sources mention a MiG-23ML from Squadron 73 that was crashed to the ground
What Iraqi sources mentioned that we lost MIG-23ML crashed to the ground? I've never heard or seen any of our sources mention this statement since it's never happened..!

The same one claimed to be crashed for unknown reason ... I don't buy the idea of fratricide SAM kill


Do you mean me if i understand you correctly..? or another sources! if does i would like to know who (not inquisition) but just love to know no more.
The list i provided before about (Immediate take-off and Conduct of military operations during the Gulf War II) i shared for once one western website and never published before (and who claims contrary of that) let him prove the full list with full name of the pilots and time of take-off. As you can see i meant to hid some names or even give nick names to some pilots and another activities. however as i explained to you in private messages (that MIG-23ML being shot down by Iraqi Air Defense SAM), and Capt.Najim Abdullah is not the same 1st Lieutenant. Nafi Najim Abdullah (it is the similarity of names). And as i confirmed to you no Iraqi A-A friendly fired recorded in GW II 1991.
You have the right to believe whatever you see it's fit to you, but at the end this is what happened and this is the truth, that MIG-23ML killed by Iraqi SAM but the report mentioned for unknown reason. It wasn't hard to me if i want to mention from the beginning that MIG-23 killed by SAM but I'm accurate with you and didn't hid anything so why you insists the opposite i don't know...
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Unread post25 Oct 2015, 20:54

Wether hit the groung or was hit by SAM at the end its the same one the EF-111A claimed it to be Mirage
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old.iraqi.air.force

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Unread post25 Oct 2015, 21:31

oldiaf wrote:Wether hit the groung or was hit by SAM at the end its the same one the EF-111A claimed it to be Mirage

Dear let me explain something to you trough my experience and i hope you will take it from me as a friend or brother (with great admiration of your good knowledge).
Hit by SAM it's not the same hit the ground, because the first one means the pilot was in the vicinity of the air base, the second means the aircraft was at engage and each aircraft has IFF and the pilot must started before he take-off, so the F-111 or the F-15 will never ID the Iraqi MIG-23 or MIG-29 as Mirage F-1 under any condition even if they were carrying Remora ECM pods, the U.S F-15s has a great radar system able to ID the type of any aircraft (condition the other side opened his radar) in this case no engagements with out open radar, so this means the F-15 were able to ID the aircraft which it should be Mirage F-1 since Capt.Najim clashed with F-111 and this was on the early hour when the war began and that MIG-23ML took-off almost at the dawn 0500 which is mean most communication units and radar being hit and the opportunities to coordinate with air defense became low, and the opportunity to hit a friendly targets became largest and this is what happened to him.
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