Radar tactics

Unread postPosted: 11 Sep 2007, 22:50
by a1rao
So consider a situation where a couple of non-stealth but modern fighters (F15c or equivalent block F-16) are in a 3 plane group and heading against hostiles. Is it true that the leading ac (assuming no AWACS), will be the only one with the radar on? Is it true that the two trailing ac will have their radars turned off (to avoid detection) but will be getting radar info from the lead ac via data-link? Thus, even if the lead ac is targeted, the back two can get off long range bvr shots and escape detection?

Unread postPosted: 12 Sep 2007, 06:02
by LinkF16SimDude
TACOPSEC..... :whistle:

Unread postPosted: 12 Sep 2007, 06:46
by parrothead
Link - how dare you say anything :wink: !

Unread postPosted: 12 Sep 2007, 07:07
by ATFS_Crash
I don’t think you will find many that will talk about such things, most that do are posers, speculators, or possibly people feeding you misinformation deliberately. ;)

Unread postPosted: 12 Sep 2007, 22:13
by a1rao
Ah, point taken- won't be asking as many radar questions anymore :)

Unread postPosted: 12 Sep 2007, 22:13
by a1rao
Ah, point taken- won't be asking as many radar questions anymore :)

Unread postPosted: 13 Sep 2007, 03:57
by Gums
Salute!

What makes you think anyone in the formation will have any radar on?

Go look at the 60's USAF interceptors, and the 70's ones, and another clue - the Tomcat, Fulcrum, etc.

out,

Unread postPosted: 13 Sep 2007, 21:28
by a1rao
Gums,

I was just assuming that one radar would atleast be on because this situation did not allow for ground controlled radar intercept and also assumes no awacs or UAV that is data-linking radar info to the three ship formation. In a real world situation, none of the three jets would have their radars on to avoid detection;however, they would be recieving info from some external source.

How would they be able to get target acquistion if they were no external means to feed radar info(unless they flashed their radar on and off)?

I don't know how applicable this is to real life scenarios- maybe mock dogfights or air-excercises with certrain "rules". I am just an enthusiast so I don't know an iota about the real life operational info on dogfights.

Regards,

Unread postPosted: 14 Sep 2007, 09:20
by parrothead
a1rao,

Just a quick note here :wink: . I can see you're new and probably don't know what not to ask. It's OK - you'll learn over time what people can and will talk about and what they can't and won't talk about just like I did :) .

Hope to see you around the boards :thumb: !

Unread postPosted: 14 Sep 2007, 12:25
by Cad
Sweden uses this tactic for the jas 39 ,but the datalink from the jas 39 it`s something else.Besides i dont like the jas 39... :)

Unread postPosted: 14 Sep 2007, 18:24
by ATFS_Crash
parrothead wrote:I can see you're new and probably don't know what not to ask. It's OK - you'll learn over time what people can and will talk about and what they can't and won't talk about just like I did :) .

Hope to see you around the boards :thumb: !

Some of us old-timers even have difficulty sometimes knowing what is appropriate to talk about. There has been many things I have been told are classified, just to see them a decade later in public print, TV or in some movie. Often I have mixed feelings; sometimes I'm glad that things are public so I can feel free to talk about them, but there are also many times that I feel angry that so many things are so public and that it is a risk to our national security. Sometimes I feel a little burned after biting my lip for decades, that the information was suddenly made public without any apparent notification. I am also sometimes aggravated at how the information is released, often it is weaseled out by reporters and courts in a manner that I often consider a risk to our national security. There has even been a few times I have been asked to shut up.

Even when I was a kid, I was once whisked away and interrogated on an elementary school tour of a secure facility when I challenged and contradicted the tour guides information. I think I either embarrassed the tour guide or was punching holes in their cover story, so I aroused their suspicion. I was asked not to contradict the guide or to publicly speculate as much, I think they also were a little suspicious I might be an elementary school spy, as much as I knew and was able to deduce. ;)

Sadly I don't think they challenge people as much or as often as they used to because of political correctness. I think national security should come first, and political correctness comes second. It was a little scary and intimidating to be whisked away and interrogated, however I realize they had their reasons, and it also was comforting that they took security so seriously, yet they treated me fairly and respectfully in my opinion. Sadly but probably wisely many of these facilities no longer offer tours to children.

Unread postPosted: 14 Sep 2007, 21:31
by a1rao
Parrot,

Yea- I am slowly getting the feel for what to ask and what not to ask. I am a very curious person by nature. Don't mean to offend or annoy anyone with my questions. Hope to see/engage in discussions with you sometime soon.


Cad, how come you dont like the Jas-39 :(

ATFS,

Also had a similar experience. Visited a secure base in another country and wanted to take pics but was not allowed. Probably for the best. For example, some of the strictest measures are undertaken by the Israeli Air force. Apparently, US service men during joint training are not allowed to even inspect a C-130 transport without being escorted by IAF personnel.

Unread postPosted: 15 Sep 2007, 06:12
by Gums
Salute!

Tink it would be nice to see a1rao's profile completed - very scant, and I am getting more and more curious about the trend of his questions and assertions on this thread and some others.

tap, tap, tap Parrot-breath

out,

Unread postPosted: 22 Oct 2007, 17:49
by Cad
Cad, how come you dont like the Jas-39 ?

Because this is the jet that we probably going to use here in Romania. ( budget concerns)

Unread postPosted: 22 Oct 2007, 19:30
by elp
Gums wrote:Salute!

Tink it would be nice to see a1rao's profile completed - very scant, and I am getting more and more curious about the trend of his questions and assertions on this thread and some others.

tap, tap, tap Parrot-breath

out,


Don't tell him why many many years ago F-15 guys put a cheap 4x kmart quality scope on their dash next to the HUD. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Unread postPosted: 24 Nov 2007, 04:23
by SixerViper
Well, we could tell you, but then we'd have to take you out back and shoot you!

Unread postPosted: 26 Nov 2007, 08:19
by Spartan-120
I know why, but since I'm still a nugget around here, I'll keep my yap shut.

Unread postPosted: 14 Jan 2008, 06:21
by a1rao
Don't tell him why many many years ago F-15 guys put a cheap 4x kmart quality scope on their dash next to the HUD.


Was it to make Ivan think that it was some sort of IR pointer as in the Mig-29? Heard of another story where F-15 crews attached a MXU-648/A baggage pod with odd antennas as a fake EW pod. It was shown off to a Bear crew, who photographed and reported it back to Russian intel

Unread postPosted: 14 Jan 2008, 17:53
by ACMIguy
Watch History Channel's Dogfight series. You'll learn all you should know from that.

The scope was for low level bikini spotting when flying over water.... :lmao:

Unread postPosted: 27 Feb 2009, 13:02
by skyhigh
Keep the tactics secret, OK!