Russia providing Air Cover for Turkey in Al-Bab

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geokav

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Unread post04 Jan 2017, 14:00

airforces_freak wrote:Assuming he does indeed become President, the question then becomes: is the new Administration prepared for a new world war?

Alliances are shifting and North Korea, Turkey etc also have Military and Intelligence Cooperation Agreements with China and Russia. If the Trump Administration (assuming nothing happens) seeks to bully someone in the Chinese-Russian camp how well would this go down? Another cold war?

I am beginning to think that the Trump Administration is no longer interested in policing the world or being the "leader of the free world" and more interested in making "America great again". I think they will willingly cede control of the Middle East and Central Asia to others and focus more on domestic politics- the US Economy etc.

I think we can all agree that either way the world is in a F**ked up situation.


You have a point in this...
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airforces_freak

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Unread post04 Jan 2017, 14:14

geokav wrote:
airforces_freak wrote:
geokav wrote:Don't forget to bomb the Leo2 A4 and the armored vehicles, those that the turkish soldiers abandon and run away...
Maybe the isis monkeys find a way to operate them...


Because ISIS is going to procure 120mm ammunition to support the Leo2's.


Did your government send Leo2 to a war zone without ammunition...?


Leo 2's have roughly 12 rounds of ammo stored in the left part of turret back and another 15 rounds in the frontal part of the tank next to the driver. ISIS is not going to win a war with 27 rounds of 120mm Ammo (assuming that the MBT's were captured with full weapons load- some would have already been fired by Turkish personel). AFAIK no Leo2 resupply vehicles were captured by ISIS. Thus they at the most have a very finite amount of ammunition.
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botsing

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Unread post04 Jan 2017, 14:59

airforces_freak wrote:
popcorn wrote:We'll see how many remain after a Trump first term.


Assuming he does indeed become President, the question then becomes: is the new Administration prepared for a new world war?

:roll:

airforces_freak: stop thinking about your world war for a while and that USA politics is done the Turkish way, instead lets take a look at the near future of your region:

* May 2017: Iranian presidential elections. Expect this election to be all about the nuclear agreement. Mayor players: Iran, USA and EU.

* June 2017: 50-year anniversary of the Six Day War. A day for symbolic gestures where Palestinian leaders may declare independence and try to get a UN majority for this. Trump will very likely block this which will result in calls for more action and possibly another Intifada. Mayor players: State of Palestine, Israel and USA.

* 2017: Saudi Arabia wil start major economical reforms with the five-year National Transformation Program. The NTP aims to rebalance the Saudi budget. The NTP also seeks to decrease unemployment and improve the domestic industrial military complex. Mayor player: Saudi Arabia.

* 2017: Turkey will seek to control the region from al-Bab to Manbij, this poses a risk since it will create a situation where they cannot easily withdraw from. Erdogan will probably move on to create a safe zone that will antagonize their allies (both east and west).

Not only Syria poses a risk to Turkey but with the increasing Iranian interest in the region Iraq is getting hard to stay out of too, the power-vacuum in cities such as Sinjar, Mosul, Arbil and Kirkuk will force Iran and Turkey into a geopolitical struggle. On top of that it is expected that Turkey and Iran will escalate the exploitation of the ethnosectarian balance in Beirut, Damascus, and Baghdad. It is also expected that Iran and Turkey will both try to establish political and military ties to their respective Kurdish factions.

Mayor players: Turkey, Iran, Syria, Kurds and Iraq.


What I mostly see for Turkey is an increasing power-struggle with Iran and the need for a safe zone. The creation of that safe zone will antagonize the other powers, and the power-struggle with Iran might move differently than Turkey is expecting: western companies are currently investing a lot in Iran and that makes the promise of Trump to undo the agreement unlikely.
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airforces_freak

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Unread post04 Jan 2017, 15:56

botsing wrote:
airforces_freak wrote:
popcorn wrote:We'll see how many remain after a Trump first term.


Assuming he does indeed become President, the question then becomes: is the new Administration prepared for a new world war?

:roll:

airforces_freak: stop thinking about your world war for a while and that USA politics is done the Turkish way, instead lets take a look at the near future of your region:

* May 2017: Iranian presidential elections. Expect this election to be all about the nuclear agreement. Mayor players: Iran, USA and EU.

* June 2017: 50-year anniversary of the Six Day War. A day for symbolic gestures where Palestinian leaders may declare independence and try to get a UN majority for this. Trump will very likely block this which will result in calls for more action and possibly another Intifada. Mayor players: State of Palestine, Israel and USA.

* 2017: Saudi Arabia wil start major economical reforms with the five-year National Transformation Program. The NTP aims to rebalance the Saudi budget. The NTP also seeks to decrease unemployment and improve the domestic industrial military complex. Mayor player: Saudi Arabia.

* 2017: Turkey will seek to control the region from al-Bab to Manbij, this poses a risk since it will create a situation where they cannot easily withdraw from. Erdogan will probably move on to create a safe zone that will antagonize their allies (both east and west).

Not only Syria poses a risk to Turkey but with the increasing Iranian interest in the region Iraq is getting hard to stay out of too, the power-vacuum in cities such as Sinjar, Mosul, Arbil and Kirkuk will force Iran and Turkey into a geopolitical struggle. On top of that it is expected that Turkey and Iran will escalate the exploitation of the ethnosectarian balance in Beirut, Damascus, and Baghdad. It is also expected that Iran and Turkey will both try to establish political and military ties to their respective Kurdish factions.

Mayor players: Turkey, Iran, Syria, Kurds and Iraq.


What I mostly see for Turkey is an increasing power-struggle with Iran and the need for a safe zone. The creation of that safe zone will antagonize the other powers, and the power-struggle with Iran might move differently than Turkey is expecting: western companies are currently investing a lot in Iran and that makes the promise of Trump to undo the agreement unlikely.


The moment Iran cozzies up to the US, Russia will abandon them. We are already seeing signs that Russia is favouring a relationships with Turkey over Iran. E.g. http://www.yenisafak.com/en/world/russi ... ou-2581026

Turkey has resolved all issues with Iraq: The Kurdistan Regional Government has gone as far as stating that it will go to war with the YPG if it does not leave KRG territory. See http://www.breitbart.com/national-secur ... -possible/

The Iraqi PM has also stated that it will not allow the PKK to attack Turkey from its soil: http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/iraq-w ... sCatID=352

Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan is sufficient to contain Iranian ambitions in the region.
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vilters

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Unread post04 Jan 2017, 16:16

That's today, how about tomorrow?
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botsing

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Unread post04 Jan 2017, 17:44

airforces_freak wrote:The moment Iran cozzies up to the US, Russia will abandon them. We are already seeing signs that Russia is favouring a relationships with Turkey over Iran. E.g. http://www.yenisafak.com/en/world/russi ... ou-2581026

Lovely wishful thinking from a lovely biased source, your preferred method to "prove" things.

airforces_freak wrote:Turkey has resolved all issues with Iraq: The Kurdistan Regional Government has gone as far as stating that it will go to war with the YPG if it does not leave KRG territory. See http://www.breitbart.com/national-secur ... -possible/

The Iraqi PM has also stated that it will not allow the PKK to attack Turkey from its soil: http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/iraq-w ... sCatID=352

Again some lovely sources you bring there.

I hope that you understand that this trend together with your wishful thinking makes you an untrustworthy person and anything you post suspect by default. You are deteriorating the reliability of information presented on this forum and by doing that you make me agree with XanderCrews conclusion about you.

airforces_freak wrote:Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan is sufficient to contain Iranian ambitions in the region.

Tell me more about how the Turkish people love Saudi Arabia: http://www.pewglobal.org/2013/10/17/sau ... -neighbors

"Turkey, which is not only a regional neighbor but a fellow G20 member, is the only country polled where as many as half (53%) see the Saudi kingdom in a negative light."
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geokav

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Unread post04 Jan 2017, 22:49

airforces_freak wrote:Leo 2's have roughly 12 rounds of ammo stored in the left part of turret back and another 15 rounds in the frontal part of the tank next to the driver. ISIS is not going to win a war with 27 rounds of 120mm Ammo (assuming that the MBT's were captured with full weapons load- some would have already been fired by Turkish personel). AFAIK no Leo2 resupply vehicles were captured by ISIS. Thus they at the most have a very finite amount of ammunition.


15 in the left part of the turret, and 27 next to the driver, that makes total 42 rounds. But of course my comment didn't suggest that ISIS monkeys can drive, or even more, can fight with those tanks. Of course not. I'm surprised you even thought of it, but anyway.
It's about the prestige of the 8th biggest army in the world... Some monkeys made the mighty turkish soldiers to abandon tanks, weapons, personal documents, firearms, armored vehicles, and who knows what else....
So Erdogan hoped that ISIS would wipe out the Kurdish people in North Syria, with the help of the turkmanis also, but it didn't happened that way, cause Putin came up. It was an unpleasant surprise for Erdo.
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XanderCrews

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Unread post05 Jan 2017, 00:03

airforces_freak wrote:
Assuming he does indeed become President, the question then becomes: is the new Administration prepared for a new world war?



Was the last one? Will the next one after trump be?

Again you must not get how it works. He won. He will be president. The end.

This current issue is no where near as bad as it was during the peaks of the cold war. It still pales in comparison to other actual wars. Apologies for not getting wet over Turkish posturing, I've been involved in actual wars (even in that region!) and this isn't even foreplay.

Again your love and desire for high drama pales in comparison to actual problems. Just because Turkey is in turmoil doesn't mean the whole world is going to follow them down the retarded rabbit hole.

The mere fact that you don't understand basic US political rules does not help your credibility
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vilters

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Unread post05 Jan 2017, 00:06

Ach, I don't expect this to last much longer for Erdolan.
When you put half of your military staff, police force, and "free press" in jail?

Then close off all "press" that does not dance to your wishes, then prove that you are unable to handle the situation, then something far more serious is about to happen in that region. If those "rebel forces" would stop fighting each other and all turn to their common enemy, Erdolan is history.

I don't think he understands the word "freedom"either.
The borders between religion, politics, justice. He does not have a clue what democracy is.
Freedom of religion, freedom of opinion, freedom to agree or disagree, freedom of social media, freedom of press (all press).
Sooner or later, the people of Turkey will open their eyes and see that he is pulling them down FAST.

This has nothing to do with religion any more, this is pure "one man show dictatorship".
And we all know where those end up.
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XanderCrews

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Unread post05 Jan 2017, 00:06

airforces_freak wrote:Avoid politics and religion.

http://www.f-16.net/guidelines.html
[/quote]

That would be all of your posts
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Unread post05 Jan 2017, 00:09

geokav wrote:
airforces_freak wrote:
geokav wrote:Don't forget to bomb the Leo2 A4 and the armored vehicles, those that the turkish soldiers abandon and run away...
Maybe the isis monkeys find a way to operate them...


Because ISIS is going to procure 120mm ammunition to support the Leo2's.



I like that he didn't argue the Turkish troops would retreat and abandon their gear, the debate is how much ammo the free tanks will come with.


Lol wow
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vilters

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Unread post05 Jan 2017, 00:15

When Trump becomes president?

I think he"ll have a nice chat with China and Russia about North Korea.

There's really nothing to worry about in The Turk region to upset Trump.

Yeah, if Iran would play nuke hardball?
He"ll talk Israel into another mission to visit Iran's reactor.
No worries.
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geokav

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Unread post05 Jan 2017, 01:46

vilters wrote:Ach, I don't expect this to last much longer for Erdolan.
When you put half of your military staff, police force, and "free press" in jail?

Then close off all "press" that does not dance to your wishes, then prove that you are unable to handle the situation, then something far more serious is about to happen in that region. If those "rebel forces" would stop fighting each other and all turn to their common enemy, Erdolan is history.

I don't think he understands the word "freedom"either.
The borders between religion, politics, justice. He does not have a clue what democracy is.
Freedom of religion, freedom of opinion, freedom to agree or disagree, freedom of social media, freedom of press (all press).
Sooner or later, the people of Turkey will open their eyes and see that he is pulling them down FAST.

This has nothing to do with religion any more, this is pure "one man show dictatorship".
And we all know where those end up.

After the failed coup of 15th of July, do you imagine how many public speeches in open spaces or in institutions has Erdo made so far? More than 56. More than 10 per month... He is continually spreading fear and hate against west to his people, making them see him like a messiah..., and as the only solution. Put also the level of education of the majority which is very low, and you have the perfect mix.

But I believe its enough with this, we gave Erdo much importance...
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geokav

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Unread post05 Jan 2017, 01:57

XanderCrews wrote:I like that he didn't argue the Turkish troops would retreat and abandon their gear, the debate is how much ammo the free tanks will come with.


Lol wow

Its a standard procedure..., a solution would be to tight the crews on their seats. It wouldn't be the first time...
Last edited by geokav on 05 Jan 2017, 12:36, edited 1 time in total.
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arian

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Unread post05 Jan 2017, 02:17

You guys realize you're arguing with a 16 year old mentally deficient troll. Right?
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