Reset, Rebuild, Rethink US Defense Concepts of Operations

Unread postPosted: 22 Aug 2013, 13:01
by spazsinbad
Reset, Rebuild, Rethink US Defense Concepts of Operations 2013-08-22 by Michael W. Wynne, 21st Secretary, USAF

http://www.sldinfo.com/reset-rebuild-re ... perations/

RE: Reset, Rebuild, Rethink US Defense Concepts of Operation

Unread postPosted: 23 Aug 2013, 00:37
by rotosequence
That was a painful wall of Public Relations speak to wade through. In summary, the solution to the upcoming budgetary realities and woes is to rely on the capabilities of the expensive new toys that are available in fewer numbers due to budget cuts, at the perceived expense of proven fundamentals.

Re: RE: Reset, Rebuild, Rethink US Defense Concepts of Opera

Unread postPosted: 23 Aug 2013, 00:45
by lookieloo
rotosequence wrote:That was a painful wall of Public Relations speak to wade through. In summary, the solution to the upcoming budgetary realities and woes is to rely on the capabilities of the expensive new toys that are available in fewer numbers due to budget cuts, at the perceived expense of proven fundamentals.
... like the airpower equivalent of Civil War human wave tactics. Try again Sprey.

Re: RE: Reset, Rebuild, Rethink US Defense Concepts of Opera

Unread postPosted: 23 Aug 2013, 01:05
by rotosequence
lookieloo wrote:
rotosequence wrote:That was a painful wall of Public Relations speak to wade through. In summary, the solution to the upcoming budgetary realities and woes is to rely on the capabilities of the expensive new toys that are available in fewer numbers due to budget cuts, at the perceived expense of proven fundamentals.
... like the airpower equivalent of Civil War human wave tactics. Try again Sprey.


Having a bad feeling about shutting down pilot training schools is program agnostic, thank you very much.

RE: Re: RE: Reset, Rebuild, Rethink US Defense Concepts of O

Unread postPosted: 23 Aug 2013, 01:07
by count_to_10
I got: networking, third party targeting, and hand-off of stand-off weaponry to forward observers.

Unread postPosted: 23 Aug 2013, 01:52
by popcorn
Training methodologies will have to change and adapt to remain relevant, just like everything else,,driven by technological change, new operational requirements, fiscal considerations, etc. Forward thinking and the willingness to embrace new training concepts must supplant the "business as usual" mentality.

Unread postPosted: 23 Aug 2013, 02:24
by popcorn
Deleted

Re: RE: Reset, Rebuild, Rethink US Defense Concepts of Opera

Unread postPosted: 23 Aug 2013, 02:50
by lookieloo
rotosequence wrote:Having a bad feeling about shutting down pilot training schools is program agnostic, thank you very much.
I'm pretty sure the fundamentals can be taught without today's structure of costly, over-bloated, internationalist-feel-good exercises in which half the participants are mostly trying to collect ELINT data on the other half. Red flag isn't what it used to be from what I hear.

RE: Re: RE: Reset, Rebuild, Rethink US Defense Concepts of O

Unread postPosted: 23 Aug 2013, 03:14
by spazsinbad
From where I sit it seems from what I have read is that such large exercises will be virtual - with participants linking via their F-35 simulators and any others that can be so networked. All kinds of baddies can be simulated at the same time and so on. USN/USMC will participate sometimes at sea with their transportable sims where possible.

Unread postPosted: 23 Aug 2013, 03:44
by popcorn
The Embedded Training capability built into the jet will provide the benefits of operating the jet in the real world while simultaneously interacting with virtual constructs.. heck, they can see how the F-35 fares vs kaiju if they wanted to. :lol:

Unread postPosted: 23 Aug 2013, 04:08
by rotosequence
popcorn wrote:The Embedded Training capability built into the jet will provide the benefits of operating the jet in the real world while simultaneously interacting with virtual constructs.. heck, they can see how the F-35 fares vs kaiju if they wanted to. :lol:


I'd love to see that :p

I hope the loss of G-forces doesn't make too much difference in practice.

Unread postPosted: 23 Aug 2013, 04:47
by popcorn
rotosequence wrote:
popcorn wrote:The Embedded Training capability built into the jet will provide the benefits of operating the jet in the real world while simultaneously interacting with virtual constructs.. heck, they can see how the F-35 fares vs kaiju if they wanted to. :lol:


I'd love to see that :p

I hope the loss of G-forces doesn't make too much difference in practice.


Why the "loss of G-forces"?

Unread postPosted: 23 Aug 2013, 05:03
by arrow-nautics
DELETED

Unread postPosted: 23 Aug 2013, 06:01
by rotosequence
popcorn wrote:Why the "loss of G-forces"?


They were advocating the use of simulators rather than actual flight hours for aircraft familiarization due to cost concerns no? Unless I direly misunderstand the capabilities of Air Force flight simulators, they can't give you the forces involved in a sustained high-G maneuver.

Unread postPosted: 23 Aug 2013, 06:25
by popcorn
rotosequence wrote:
popcorn wrote:Why the "loss of G-forces"?


They were advocating the use of simulators rather than actual flight hours for aircraft familiarization due to cost concerns no? Unless I direly misunderstand the capabilities of Air Force flight simulators, they can't give you the forces involved in a sustained high-G maneuver.


Ground-based simulators are one thing.

The Embedded Training module on the F-35 is a different thing altogether. Training instructors can program different virtual threat scenarios that would be presented to pilots actually flying their jets on their respective displays, just as if this info was coming from the jets' onboard and offboard data sources. Pilots would then be free to exercise the appropriate tactics to coordinate their actions and pull Gs maneuvering their aircraft and launch simulated missiles to deal with the threat. It is intended to simulate operating in the BVR arena which is where the preponderance of A2A engagements would occur.

Unread postPosted: 23 Aug 2013, 09:13
by zero-one
With only one gun kill in the storied history of the F-15 Aircraft, and the apparent standoff ranges that are driven by triple digit integrated air defense systems, re-thinking future warfare may be upon them.



I'm sory, but I dont quite understand this statement, what Gun kill was he reffering to? the USAF has never had a Gun kill in the Eagle and if he's talking about the IADF, didn't they have more than 1 during the 1982 lebanon war.

Does he maen that the future holds less dogfight training and to focus more on SEAD training against triple digit IADS?

Unread postPosted: 23 Aug 2013, 10:15
by spazsinbad
There are several avenues for sim training either on the ground or in the air as mentioned by 'popcorn'. There are several threads about these issues and lack of G-forces (probably very minor in the BVR scenario as mentioned by 'popcorn'). What is important is how the 'pack of four' F-35s minimum work together to optimise their situational awareness along with any other supporting assets and how they co-ordinate their mission. The F-35 is the Joint STRIKE Fighter after all. Why not train to the strengths of the F-35 rather than some imagined old school scenario. These issues have been canvassed ad nauseam on this forum. Go read up on these threads about simulation for a starters. Just about every second thread ends up in some bulshite discussion about dogfighting so why not this one - I'll not add to it though - this response is about simulation with/without G forces. The thread below has links to other threads: Go read 'em. BTW the US is being thought of in this thread. Other users of F-35s will have other uses for the F-35 including more toward the fighter spectrum. That is another story altogether.

Live Virtual Constructive technology to revolutionize ACM
http://www.f-16.net/f-16_forum_viewtopi ... t-nlr.html
____________________

I'll guess this little beauty will be available to other aircraft - USAF willing:

JDEWR brings fight to F-16 pilots 22 Aug 2013 by Senior Airman Derek VanHorn
35th Fighter Wing Public Affairs
"8/22/2013 - MISAWA AIR BASE, Japan -- Groundbreaking advancements to F-16 Fighting Falcon warfare training here arrived last week in the form of a Joint Deployable Electronic Warfare Range, or JDEWR.

The JDEWR is a weapon system that provides tactical-level training to participants in live training events. It's implemented as a threat capable of submitting ground threat defenses for bilateral and joint missions and exercises for United States Air Force, Japan Air Self-Defense Force and Navy aircraft stationed here, according to Lt. Col. Kevin Jones, 35th Operations Support Squadron director of operations...."

http://www.misawa.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123360766

Unread postPosted: 28 Aug 2013, 01:09
by popcorn
Not directly to F-35 for now but an example of how training is evolving. This level of training would have previously required attendance at Red FLag. A good example of pushing the training to where units are actually deployed


http://alert5.com/2013/08/23/photo-join ... isawa-afb/


Previously, pilots from the 35th Fighter Wing had to fly to Red Flag exercises over at Eielson Air Force Base, Alaska, which has the JDEWR, for realistic training.

The JDEWR will be based at Misawa’s Draughon Range.